Offseason Program and Rookie Mini Camp Discussion

[titanruss]

There's a lot that goes into coaching and player acquisition, and blaming things solely on coaching is a little rough route to argue.

 

If a GM is in agreement with what the coach needs, then the GM has to pick players of the ability/skillset and work ethic to succeed. Not doing that makes a bad talent acquisition GM and it's really their main job. If they get those players and they consistently fail, that falls on the coaches. If they don't get the correct players for a coaches scheme - regardless of ability and work ethic, they will fail. Too many GMs draft solely on athletic traits.

 

Coaches fail players because they either cant put them in a situation to be most successful, or because they don't develop the talent given to them. Often the scheme will put pressure on individual positions while making it easier on others. Long developing plays put pressure on the oline while helping receivers get open deeper down field, a limited blitz defense puts pressure on DBs to cover longer, etc.

 

It can become a chicken or egg argument and is very hard to determine what is what unless players go elsewhere and do succeed... which doesn't happen often for any team/situation because once a player fails at one spot, it's rare to even get adequate opportunities in a system/position/scheme that fits them better. Usually they get thrown into a similar system because a team needs backups that know what they are doing rather than learning too much new stuff.

 

As far as JRob and Vrabel, Vrabel thought he could coach up anyone to be good because he wasn't an elite athlete and became very good himself. JRob thought he could take fliers on players because Simmons worked out well and he though players were easily replaceable because we had team success. He also seemed afraid to be Vrabels boss at times.

 

It worked out horribly in the end.  I don't think we had a true system in place nor true Architypes for the players we wanted. Players didn't fit scheme. Scheme changed a few times, so no continuity. Coaching didn't coach up, and we lost the good coaches we did have because of Vrabel.

 

A shit storm where there is fault to go around.

[croatian22]

It’s not the X’s and the O’s, but the Jimmys and the Joes that make the difference. 

 

Vrabel is the best coach in the NFL. He had the worst roster in the league last two years. 

[Somedude]

8 minutes ago, croatian22 said:

 

[titanruss]

10 minutes ago, croatian22 said:

It’s not the X’s and the O’s, but the Jimmys and the Joes that make the difference. 

 

Vrabel is the best coach in the NFL. He had the worst roster in the league last two years. 

 

Vrabel hand picked players with JRob. Part of the failed acquisitions were his picks including Rashaan Evans, his first pick, that had loads of talent and Vrable hand coached 1-on-1 for weeks and even years. Vrable also scared away and alientated very talented players like David Long that have done well elsewhere.

 

You can tell just from this staff currently that there is a sigh of relief and a learning environment that didnt exist before. That's squarely on Vrabes.

[Callidus]

1 hour ago, croatian22 said:

It’s not the X’s and the O’s, but the Jimmys and the Joes that make the difference. 

 

Vrabel is the best coach in the NFL. He had the worst roster in the league last two years. 

Did you miss Mike vrable's premature ejaculation to the willis pick? That was his guy. Not much else needed to know how good his talent Radar is.

Edited July 9, 2024 by Callidus

[IowaOiler]

2 hours ago, croatian22 said:

It’s not the X’s and the O’s, but the Jimmys and the Joes that make the difference. 

 

Vrabel is the best coach in the NFL. He had the worst roster in the league last two years. 

 

Meathead isn't even a coach in the NFL...how can he be the best?

[IowaOiler]

6 hours ago, Mythos27 said:

For sure. Development can actually take place in the NCAA. It's partly why these guys hopping in and out of the transfer portal are shooting themselves in the foot long-term. They're not giving themselves a chance to develop under a consistent system. I actually think that college is where players develop the most. It's the first time that they're essentially full-time football players. 

 

I will say, if Latham makes a successful transition to the left side, that will be because of Bill. 

 

Also, to @titanruss's point, I've always felt that good coaches are able to shift scheme and tendencies based on their personnel and the perceived weaknesses of the opponent.  You can look at the Pats and how they started as a run-first QB friendly offense in Brady's early years, to a pass-first team that crushed team when they had Moss, to a very unique two TE passing attack with suicide-boy and Gronk, then to a more balanced offense that highlighted the TE, slot, and RB in the passing game.  BB was able to coach to his personnel.

 

Meathead ran the ball until it popped.  

[titanruss]

36 minutes ago, IowaOiler said:

 

I will say, if Latham makes a successful transition to the left side, that will be because of Bill. 

 

Also, to @titanruss's point, I've always felt that good coaches are able to shift scheme and tendencies based on their personnel and the perceived weaknesses of the opponent.  You can look at the Pats and how they started as a run-first QB friendly offense in Brady's early years, to a pass-first team that crushed team when they had Moss, to a very unique two TE passing attack with suicide-boy and Gronk, then to a more balanced offense that highlighted the TE, slot, and RB in the passing game.  BB was able to coach to his personnel.

 

Meathead ran the ball until it popped.  

It's so weird how he came in and basically said they weren't going to do almost exactly what they did for the duration of his time here. 
 

I think the original intention was there, then things popped with Henry and Tannehill playing top ball with that offense that was extremely efficient. Then when things weren't working, instead of innovating and changing things, he proceeded to put it all on a RBs shoulders which is unsustainable for any RB in today's NFL. When he did try and change things, they failed for whatever reason (oline / OC / QB / RB failures) Vrabel got on tilt and just stuck with what he thought would keep games close rather than put points on the board or morph the offense into an unknown direction. 
 

The inflection point required innovation rather than conservation. He failed at that. 

[AussieTitanFan08]

 

[AussieTitanFan08]

2nd part of the Callahan OTP interview for those interesting in watching.

 

 

[Mythos27]

14 hours ago, IowaOiler said:

 

I will say, if Latham makes a successful transition to the left side, that will be because of Bill. 

 

Also, to @titanruss's point, I've always felt that good coaches are able to shift scheme and tendencies based on their personnel and the perceived weaknesses of the opponent.  You can look at the Pats and how they started as a run-first QB friendly offense in Brady's early years, to a pass-first team that crushed team when they had Moss, to a very unique two TE passing attack with suicide-boy and Gronk, then to a more balanced offense that highlighted the TE, slot, and RB in the passing game.  BB was able to coach to his personnel.

 

Meathead ran the ball until it popped.  

His rigidity and arrogance absolutely destroyed him. No doubt about that. He clearly thought there was just one way to win games on offense. Definitely didn't take after Belichick. I'll certainly give Bill C his due but IMO if Latham succeeds it's because he had it in him to succeed and we'll know that for sure. What we won't know is if he could've succeeded under most coaches. The answer that one is probably not though. 

[AussieTitanFan08]

 

[Mythos27]

13 hours ago, AussieTitanFan08 said:

 

Not to toot my own horn but...toot toot. Been saying this for years. 

[AussieTitanFan08]

18 minutes ago, Mythos27 said:

Not to toot my own horn but...toot toot. Been saying this for years. 

 

Levis and this newly constructed OL need plenty of live reps this preseason and wouldn't be at all opposed to them playing an entire half in one of the games.

[titanskick8851]

On 7/10/2024 at 3:39 PM, AussieTitanFan08 said: