JRob Fired. Wyatt Confirmed.

[OzTitan]

22 minutes ago, ctm said:

Spotrac puts Geno Smith's average annual value at 36.4M

 

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/seattle-seahawks/geno-smith-12320/market-value/

 

I'm looking at the QB APY table and I can't see how his agent will let him sign for less than Carr's (which was $40M).

[oldschool]

19 minutes ago, OzTitan said:

 

I'm looking at the QB APY table and I can't see how his agent will let him sign for less than Carr's (which was $40M).

 

whats the tag for QBs? I'd be hesitant to give Smith a big contract based on one year.

[ctm]

6 minutes ago, oldschool said:

 

whats the tag for QBs? I'd be hesitant to give Smith a big contract based on one year.

29.7M for 2022

[japan]

6 hours ago, titaninpgh said:

The Houston Texans produced five winning records in six full seasons under Vrabel’s friend and former boss, Bill O’Brien, only to implode after the coach amassed all the power, leaving two GMs in his wake.

“(Vrabel) is following the Bill O’Brien playbook to a T,” a former GM said on the condition of anonymity in order to speak freely on the subject.

“I don’t see it that way,” another exec said. “People who think that are missing who the major player is in this whole thing.”

Vrabel was indeed convincing in explaining he was out of the loop on this franchise-altering decision. Whatever the case, the Titans might look back on this period as the moment when a recently successful franchise became a more volatile one. Robinson might be departing at the right time.

There is almost no scenario by which this turn of events reflects well on the Titans.

• If Vrabel won some sort of power play with Robinson, the way O’Brien outlasted former Texans GMs Rick Smith and Brian Gaine, that would be bad for Tennessee. Under that scenario, the Titans would be more vulnerable to the whims of a single individual who, despite his success as a head coach, has less experience in league and operational matters. They might be more vulnerable to that anyway, depending upon who Adams Strunk hires in Robinson’s place.

“Be careful what you wish for as an owner,” the former GM quoted above said. “Don’t go giving your head coach carte blanche, especially when they are a strong-minded guy.”

Vrabel comes from Houston, where the Texans did go down that road, to the point that they behaved unconventionally and sometimes erratically. They hired Jack Easterby, traded No. 1 receiver DeAndre Hopkins for a package that included an onerous running back contract, traded two first-round picks and a second-rounder for left tackle Laremy Tunsil, etc.

Before Vrabel was in Houston, he worked under Urban Meyer at Ohio State. Before that, he played for New England, where power also was concentrated in one decision maker.

Unlike in Houston, where widespread reports suggested O’Brien and Smith were at odds, there have been no such reports regarding Vrabel and Robinson. Yes, Vrabel appeared and sounded frustrated by the team’s decision to trade Brown, but the coach sounded believable when explaining he didn’t know this move was coming down.

“I examine what Vrabel says carefully, and most of it is the truth,” a longtime NFL team exec said. “There is some obvious coachspeak he’s gotta say, but also, he delves into the other parts where it gets personal and you know it’s true.”

However this all came down, Vrabel is likely to emerge with greater say over personnel, especially if ownership includes him in the hiring process.

“They are probably going to hire some first-time guy the coach approves of, because that is just the way these things go,” an exec said. “When the owner gives those soft answers, it’s usually because someone has convinced them. It hardly ever works when someone is the power coach. You can easily make the case Vrabel hasn’t coached long enough to learn the intricacies of personnel, player acquisition, trade and free-agent markets, not to mention the salary cap and all the other things GMs do that go way beyond the draft. Everyone will say he is going to get help, but this the classic, ‘Only the people I trust.’ ”

• If Vrabel knew nothing about Robinson’s firing, that is also bad for the Titans, and possibly bad for Vrabel, because there’s a demonstrated level of unpredictability when it comes to making the biggest decisions. One day, Robinson owned the ninth-best winning percentage of any GM in the league, without finishing any season .500 or worse. The next day, he was gone.

“People are saying the major players in the whole narrative are Jon Robinson and Mike Vrabel,” a coach from another team said. “I don’t see it that way. The major player is the majority owner, who no one knows anything about. She dropped the hammer on a guy who, by all accounts, is doing no better or worse than any of the other guys who have been in the league as long as he has. What is her angle? What is she not happy with? Where does she see this going?

“If you take it from the perspective of Vrabel is orchestrating it, then that is the answer, but if you take it from the perspective of the owner is not happy and is trying to do something bigger, it’s different. Theoretically, even Vrabel could be on the outs, if this person is unhappy.”

The way Adams Strunk spoke to Walker in the on-camera interview reminded two former longtime Titans employees of her late father Bud, who was famous for making decisions impulsively. One of these former employees said the idea that she possibly fired Robinson in reaction to enduring Philly fans’ taunts as Brown lit up the Tennessee secondary reminded him of the time Bud Adams flipped off Buffalo Bills fans from the owners’ box in 2009.

“She did that interview from her desk where she reminded me a lot of Bud, where she said, ‘I knew my mind was made up, so why wait?’ ” one of the former employees said. “I just don’t see how it gives you an advantage doing this now if you are going to make the playoffs. If you are not making the playoffs, then doing it now gives you an advantage. It shows you are taking action and now you are going to find the next person to lead the franchise.”

Even after losing Sunday, The Athletic’s playoff model projects Tennessee with an 89 percent chance of reaching the postseason.

• I think Robinson is departing at the right time and would venture that his .604 win rate as the Titans’ GM, which included going 9-7 twice with Mike Mularkey as head coach, will be better than the Titans’ win rate under his successor. While Robinson succeeded in his two most important duties by finding the right head coach and a successful quarterback in Ryan Tannehill, the rest of the roster has suffered from misses in the draft and attrition through free agency. We have probably seen the best of Tannehill in Tennessee. Derrick Henryis on pace for 1,568 yards rushing this season, defying expectations of decline, but the decline is coming, probably sooner than later. The road ahead is likely to get steeper, and if the owner’s handling of Robinson’s firing is any indication, that road could be bumpier as well.

Good article. Lot of people around here trust that Strunk knows what she’s doing because she made the right hire in Robinson and let him work, but she is still Bud Adams offspring….

[Nash]

This morning’s thought after reading this article:  It’s been reported that Amy and the family had to mortgage everything they had to come up with 700 million for the new stadium.. JRob wasted significant money on missed draft picks(his job) and wasted even more on Clowney, Beasley, Woods, Dupree, Jamarcus Jones, Dennis Dayley, Jackrabbit, Cunningham and now the bills have come due.. if I were stretched financially because of malfeasance of an employee, I’d make a change also.. furthermore, Amy must have felt JRob took advantage of her and his authority, so as you guys have said, the trust was broken

[Nash]

Not to forget, she’s paid for significant facilities and staff upgrades , further stressing the finances

[IrishTitansFan]

2 hours ago, DecepticonShawn2 said:

He was on fire first 5 weeks but his efficiency has taken a dip recently. Still one of the best stories of this season though.

He has 8 100+ passer rating games in his last 10

[IrishTitansFan]

1 hour ago, oldschool said:

 

whats the tag for QBs? I'd be hesitant to give Smith a big contract based on one year.

Maybe, but we weren't hesitant when the Titans did it with Tannehill

 

 

Geno looked way better than Wilson last year too when he played and apparently has been improving for years. McAdoo basically all but said he was much better than Eli Manning in New York and he got fired for benching Manning for him

 

He still probably put the ball in harms way too much, but man he reads a defense on par with anyone, is aggressive as hell, good mobility, his pocket presence has now gone from a big weakness to a strength, accuracy etc etc

 

Just off of this year, he is genuinely one of the best QB's in the NFL, I'd probably be fine with giving him a big contract just like I was fine with giving Tannehill one

[tgo]

7 hours ago, titaninpgh said:

The Houston Texans produced five winning records in six full seasons under Vrabel’s friend and former boss, Bill O’Brien, only to implode after the coach amassed all the power, leaving two GMs in his wake.

“(Vrabel) is following the Bill O’Brien playbook to a T,” a former GM said on the condition of anonymity in order to speak freely on the subject.

“I don’t see it that way,” another exec said. “People who think that are missing who the major player is in this whole thing.”

Vrabel was indeed convincing in explaining he was out of the loop on this franchise-altering decision. Whatever the case, the Titans might look back on this period as the moment when a recently successful franchise became a more volatile one. Robinson might be departing at the right time.

There is almost no scenario by which this turn of events reflects well on the Titans.

• If Vrabel won some sort of power play with Robinson, the way O’Brien outlasted former Texans GMs Rick Smith and Brian Gaine, that would be bad for Tennessee. Under that scenario, the Titans would be more vulnerable to the whims of a single individual who, despite his success as a head coach, has less experience in league and operational matters. They might be more vulnerable to that anyway, depending upon who Adams Strunk hires in Robinson’s place.

“Be careful what you wish for as an owner,” the former GM quoted above said. “Don’t go giving your head coach carte blanche, especially when they are a strong-minded guy.”

Vrabel comes from Houston, where the Texans did go down that road, to the point that they behaved unconventionally and sometimes erratically. They hired Jack Easterby, traded No. 1 receiver DeAndre Hopkins for a package that included an onerous running back contract, traded two first-round picks and a second-rounder for left tackle Laremy Tunsil, etc.

Before Vrabel was in Houston, he worked under Urban Meyer at Ohio State. Before that, he played for New England, where power also was concentrated in one decision maker.

Unlike in Houston, where widespread reports suggested O’Brien and Smith were at odds, there have been no such reports regarding Vrabel and Robinson. Yes, Vrabel appeared and sounded frustrated by the team’s decision to trade Brown, but the coach sounded believable when explaining he didn’t know this move was coming down.

“I examine what Vrabel says carefully, and most of it is the truth,” a longtime NFL team exec said. “There is some obvious coachspeak he’s gotta say, but also, he delves into the other parts where it gets personal and you know it’s true.”

However this all came down, Vrabel is likely to emerge with greater say over personnel, especially if ownership includes him in the hiring process.

“They are probably going to hire some first-time guy the coach approves of, because that is just the way these things go,” an exec said. “When the owner gives those soft answers, it’s usually because someone has convinced them. It hardly ever works when someone is the power coach. You can easily make the case Vrabel hasn’t coached long enough to learn the intricacies of personnel, player acquisition, trade and free-agent markets, not to mention the salary cap and all the other things GMs do that go way beyond the draft. Everyone will say he is going to get help, but this the classic, ‘Only the people I trust.’ ”

• If Vrabel knew nothing about Robinson’s firing, that is also bad for the Titans, and possibly bad for Vrabel, because there’s a demonstrated level of unpredictability when it comes to making the biggest decisions. One day, Robinson owned the ninth-best winning percentage of any GM in the league, without finishing any season .500 or worse. The next day, he was gone.

“People are saying the major players in the whole narrative are Jon Robinson and Mike Vrabel,” a coach from another team said. “I don’t see it that way. The major player is the majority owner, who no one knows anything about. She dropped the hammer on a guy who, by all accounts, is doing no better or worse than any of the other guys who have been in the league as long as he has. What is her angle? What is she not happy with? Where does she see this going?

“If you take it from the perspective of Vrabel is orchestrating it, then that is the answer, but if you take it from the perspective of the owner is not happy and is trying to do something bigger, it’s different. Theoretically, even Vrabel could be on the outs, if this person is unhappy.”

The way Adams Strunk spoke to Walker in the on-camera interview reminded two former longtime Titans employees of her late father Bud, who was famous for making decisions impulsively. One of these former employees said the idea that she possibly fired Robinson in reaction to enduring Philly fans’ taunts as Brown lit up the Tennessee secondary reminded him of the time Bud Adams flipped off Buffalo Bills fans from the owners’ box in 2009.

“She did that interview from her desk where she reminded me a lot of Bud, where she said, ‘I knew my mind was made up, so why wait?’ ” one of the former employees said. “I just don’t see how it gives you an advantage doing this now if you are going to make the playoffs. If you are not making the playoffs, then doing it now gives you an advantage. It shows you are taking action and now you are going to find the next person to lead the franchise.”

Even after losing Sunday, The Athletic’s playoff model projects Tennessee with an 89 percent chance of reaching the postseason.

• I think Robinson is departing at the right time and would venture that his .604 win rate as the Titans’ GM, which included going 9-7 twice with Mike Mularkey as head coach, will be better than the Titans’ win rate under his successor. While Robinson succeeded in his two most important duties by finding the right head coach and a successful quarterback in Ryan Tannehill, the rest of the roster has suffered from misses in the draft and attrition through free agency. We have probably seen the best of Tannehill in Tennessee. Derrick Henryis on pace for 1,568 yards rushing this season, defying expectations of decline, but the decline is coming, probably sooner than later. The road ahead is likely to get steeper, and if the owner’s handling of Robinson’s firing is any indication, that road could be bumpier as well.

 

Really spot on write-up. This is a good piece. 

 

Sando is one of the more insightful NFL observers out there for sure, esp as it relates to Tennessee. 

[Mythos27]

8 minutes ago, IrishTitansFan said:

Maybe, but we weren't hesitant when the Titans did it with Tannehill

 

 

Geno looked way better than Wilson last year too when he played and apparently has been improving for years. McAdoo basically all but said he was much better than Eli Manning in New York and he got fired for benching Manning for him

 

He still probably put the ball in harms way too much, but man he reads a defense on par with anyone, is aggressive as hell, good mobility, his pocket presence has now gone from a big weakness to a strength, accuracy etc etc

 

Just off of this year, he is genuinely one of the best QB's in the NFL, I'd probably be fine with giving him a big contract just like I was fine with giving Tannehill one

Hypothetically, if we could get him for comparable money to Tannehill do you pull the trigger?

[IrishTitansFan]

21 minutes ago, Mythos27 said:

Hypothetically, if we could get him for comparable money to Tannehill do you pull the trigger?

That's tough.

 

We know how well Tannehill fits what the Titans want to do. He's tough as nails, one of the most accurate QB's in the NFL, bails out bad receivers with elite ball placement in tight windows etc and doesn't turn the ball over too much in general

 

On the other hand I'd say Geno is more well rounded, moves around better in the pocket, way better pre-snap, more aggressive probably and goes through his progressions better

 

Geno is younger but there is a better risk he regresses, we know Tanny is good

 

 

I think Geno has been the better QB this year but I might lean Tanny for familiarity if it was just for next year. I think they're both top 10-12 QB's 

[Mythos27]

2 minutes ago, IrishTitansFan said:

That's tough.

 

We know how well Tannehill fits what the Titans want to do. He's tough as nails, one of the most accurate QB's in the NFL, bails out bad receivers with elite ball placement in tight windows etc and doesn't turn the ball over too much in general

 

On the other hand I'd say Geno is more well rounded, moves around better in the pocket, way better pre-snap, more aggressive probably and goes through his progressions better

 

Geno is younger but there is a better risk he regresses, we know Tanny is good

 

 

I think Geno has been the better QB this year but I might lean Tanny for familiarity if it was just for next year. I think they're both top 10-12 QB's 

Right. Where I would be hesitant with Geno is that even at his current level of play, he isn't a special QB, merely a good one. I don't think I'm ready to move off of Tannehill unless he independently starts to suck or a special QB is within reach. 

[IsntLifeFunny]

There's simply no way we drop Tannehill for Geno. They're very similar players even if Geno is slightly better. We keep Tannehill and go the Alex Smith route or we go full on tank route. 

[tgo]

3 minutes ago, IsntLifeFunny said:

There's simply no way we drop Tannehill for Geno. They're very similar players even if Geno is slightly better. We keep Tannehill and go the Alex Smith route or we go full on tank route. 

Best Tannehill alternative is a bridge guy who can sit in for a rookie and/or give Willis more time to develop. Use the extra cap space to create a running juggernaut with Henry.

 

Would be an obvious downgrade on Tannehill but with that cap space you can sign 3 higher end 2023 starters on offense. 
 

If it were up to me, I’d still roll with Tannehill but Vrabel will be under pressure to make changes. 

Edited December 13, 2022 by tgo

[BudsOilers]

3 hours ago, DecepticonShawn2 said:

 

 

Just as bad as ours wtf? Seattle fixed their oline because they knew Geno would need it you know the opposite of what we do for Tannehill.

 

 

Russ is the dumbest poster on here.  He always lies about stats and makes a fool of himself.  Why folks interact with that moron is beyond me.