The Game of Thrones

[Rogue]

1 hour ago, Mercalius said:

Those earlier scenes where folks were chosen as leaders worked because they had just accomplished great things or it made sense in the flow of the narrative.  This literally felt like they drew a name out of a hat.  Why was he the best choice?  Because he’s a Stark?  So is Sansa.  So is Arya.  So is Jon, kinda.  Because he’s a male?   He very likely can’t reproduce due to his accident.  So traditional hierarchal rules are basically out the window.  

At the moment they had decided leadership would be chosen by the lords and ladys, the traditional hierarchical rules were thrown at the window.  That was the point.  

 

I suspect that he nominated Bran partly because of his knowledge of the past, but to actually not have a heir to the thrown have the crown.  And in that moment of not having anyone other than Jon having a solid claim, and entering a knew political world, the only surviving son of Ned Stark, who also can't continue the line,  might be the choice that everyone could get on board with.  

 

Would have been nice to see this fleshed out better, as with much of the arcs in this season, but it is what it is.  

 

I'm okay with the way it turned out.  Sure, the writing had lots of room to be better, but I accepted last season this wasn't going to be the case.  

[Rogue]

57 minutes ago, Jamalisms said:

I think the reality is that I was frustrated with this show for a number of years, and then was ready to murder someone around episode 3, and so I'm onto a different stage of grief than most of you.  I'm disappointed but not raging.

 

It's been evident they can't write for years. It's been evident that they are shrinking the cast of characters and the way the characters interact for years. They haven't been building organically or interweaving intricate plot for years. They choose a destination and provide crappy rationale to get there. Tyrion has been a prop used to put Dany in tough situations or to give Cersei and upper hand and he hasn't had his own true plot line for years - and he was the most popular, fascinating character ... and he even stayed central to the plot and had a large role in the finale ... and they still gave up his storyline. And it's been evident since they announced the shortened seasons, which was a few years ago, that they are moving on no matter what anyone says and no matter the wisdom of trying to wrap it up that quickly.

 

So, for all of those complications and problems, I thought they executed what it is pretty well the last three episodes, overall. With some really ugly crap happening that was hard to believe they found acceptable.

 

One thing not discussed much but it's of no to me, is how they added to Dany's madness / mental snap a layer of world domination and abuse in the name of ending abuse and it was, I think, a major save of that storyline. It made the turn against her completely believable.

 

But they never really sold Jon loving her or why he would love her. So him struggling with it so much didn't land despite that you knew that what they were trying to show you was he loved her and it was crushing him. Instead he just looked like stupid Jon walking into another bad idea with his heart on his sleeve.

 

Heck, I think the idea of Greyworm becoming a problem and trying to address the question of what happens to an army when its leader is assassinated is a fascinating subject that could have used an entire episode to develop. Hell, you could turn that into an entire season if you wanted to explore all of the complexity there and the possible negotiations and war craft that could develop. But instead we got him giving up on minutes for no reason.

 

It's just all part of the same issue of time and development. Almost nothing that they ended up accomplishing was problematic by itself. It's all about how they got there and the fact that it didn't land. And the fact that it was different from the nature of the show before.

 

I think they probably should have done more seasons but even if they want to end after 8 seasons ... fine. You can spend an episode on hellos and another episode on goodbyes in a 10-episode run but not when you only have 6 episodes. You can have the Night King defeated in a single battle if you have that stretch somehow across multiple episodes and have a cliffhanger and true sense of peril in the middle ... and not the crap that they put on screen where people survive despite how they're presented in impossible situations and TV magic saves the day with plot armor. And you can develop Dany and Jon and develop Greyworm  turning cold after the death of Missandei and all the other stuff so much better with extra episodes. You can show us many of the scenes that they just skipped because it was easier. We should have seen Jamie talk to Bran when he arrived at Einterfell. We should have seen Sansa and Arya react to the news of Jon's heritage. We should have seen Sansa and Tyrion truly talking about the merits of Jon versus Dany. We should have seen the aftermath of Dany dying, at least the immediate aftermath.

 

There are so many things they could have done and the timeline did not allow for it. And that is just unforced and it was a choice and it was wrong and it was so substantial and meaningful that in many ways it is just simple and clear that these two producers, personally, ruined the show ... to the degree it was ruined.

Obviously, there was enough story to work through to have a full season, but they didn't have the material to pull from.  I think they either couldn't come up with development of the arcs on their own (of which they would have had to match GRRM's talents....and of which he hasn't finished), was done working on the show and expedited it all, or felt GRRM gave them the outline for the end and didn't want to go much beyond that so that he can finish the story in the way he needs to.  Or possibly a combination of all three.  

 

Plenty of plot holes and questions of how some arcs were made it to be that could have been explored.  They leaned on dramatization more than I would have liked.  As an outline, I'm okay with its ending.  More details would have been great, but GRRM doesn't have them either and I'm guessing they decided to let him figure it out.  

 

Interesting thing, as much criticism there has been of the show as of late, not only was this the most viewed episode in GOT's history, it is the most viewed single telecast in HBO's history.  Good, bad, or otherwise, a whole lot of people were in it to the end.  

 

 

 

[Jamalisms]

I'd be willing to give Dumb and Dumber a pass if they didn't force the brevity and skip the hard stuff (like the conversations mentioned). The reality is that they coasted and hoped spectacle would save it. It's an unforced error.

[oldschool]

29 minutes ago, Rogue said:

At the moment they had decided leadership would be chosen by the lords and ladys, the traditional hierarchical rules were thrown at the window.  That was the point.  

 

I suspect that he nominated Bran partly because of his knowledge of the past, but to actually not have a heir to the thrown have the crown.  And in that moment of not having anyone other than Jon having a solid claim, and entering a knew political world, the only surviving son of Ned Stark, who also can't continue the line,  might be the choice that everyone could get on board with.  

 

Would have been nice to see this fleshed out better, as with much of the arcs in this season, but it is what it is.  

 

I'm okay with the way it turned out.  Sure, the writing had lots of room to be better, but I accepted last season this wasn't going to be the case.  

None of the others were going to support each other so Bran makes sense. The big issue with it is that Bran's character hasn't been developed for 4 seasons.

[oldschool]

2 hours ago, IsntLifeFunny said:

You said it in your own words “she didn’t view him as a threat”...yeah. That’s retarded. He’s the only threat. 

Its clear you didn't understand Dany's arc. Did you read the books? The idea she had no choice but to perceive Jon as a threat in that moment is logical fallacy on your part. 

[Number9]

On 5/17/2019 at 4:22 PM, Starkiller said:

‘Game Of Thrones’ Showrunners Disappointed With How Quality Of Fans Has Dropped Off Over Past Couple Seasons

 

Saying their once-beloved viewers have lost much of their luster in recent years, Game Of Thrones showrunners D.B. Weiss and David Benioff acknowledged Friday they have been frustrated with the way fans of the HBO series have declined in quality over the past few seasons. “During the show’s first couple of years, our viewers showed a lot of promise and challenged our assumptions about what a fan base could be,” Benioff told reporters, lamenting the fact that when Game Of Thrones moved past George R.R. Martin’s original source material, the show’s supporters began to lose coherence and now barely resemble the industry-defining audience they once were. “At this point, however, they’ve become a tired cliché. It’s hard to watch them lose everything that made us love them in the first place. Nothing they do makes any sense anymore, and it just seems like they want the show to be over with as quickly as possible. It’s pretty sad, to be honest.” At press time, Benioff and Weiss expressed regret that they failed to do more to prevent the fans from becoming so unbelievably shitty.

 

https://entertainment.theonion.com/game-of-thrones-showrunners-disappointed-with-how-qua-1834843021

Well, that sucks.  Blame us for not liking what they came up with.  GRRM should have finished the books, plain and simple.  I think the story outgrew him.  If you have ever tried to write a book, it's easy to start one.  Then you have to deal with character development and the ending.  You kind of have to have an ending to reach and I don't know that Martin accepted any of his endings.  The story just kept growing.  

 

The last of the books I read was kinda boring and lost a lot of the old flavor, swashbuckle and intrigue the characters had in the first books.  It moved to an entirely different place and was too damn long for the story it told.  GRRM just got lost.  I think possibly he tried to milk money out of his great creation, probably fearing he couldn't write more.  I'm going to see the Tolkien movie just to see how they present his creative genius' development.  

 

So, the reason the viewing audience changed is because they went past what GRRM created.  He's human, but I think he should have ended it by book four.  Verses King's Dark Tower, GOT ran out of places to go.  Time to have the final battle and be done with the book.  Themes like the Prince of Dorne fighting the Mountain.  That was awesome.  Just be done with it, don't just ramble along until Grey Worm is deciding the fate of the main character.  Okay, if you actually develop Grey Worm maybe half as much as you developed Jon Snow. 

 

Anyway, the TV show was great/one of tv's best until they ran out of material from the book to follow.  I'll go back and watch season 1-the end, it's that good.  But the energy and connection to the show ends where the books end.

[oldschool]

10 minutes ago, Number9 said:

Well, that sucks.  Blame us for not liking what they came up with.  GRRM should have finished the books, plain and simple.  I think the story outgrew him.  If you have ever tried to write a book, it's easy to start one.  Then you have to deal with character development and the ending.  You kind of have to have an ending to reach and I don't know that Martin accepted any of his endings.  The story just kept growing.  

 

The last of the books I read was kinda boring and lost a lot of the old flavor, swashbuckle and intrigue the characters had in the first books.  It moved to an entirely different place and was too damn long for the story it told.  GRRM just got lost.  I think possibly he tried to milk money out of his great creation, probably fearing he couldn't write more.  I'm going to see the Tolkien movie just to see how they present his creative genius' development.  

 

So, the reason the viewing audience changed is because they went past what GRRM created.  He's human, but I think he should have ended it by book four.  Verses King's Dark Tower, GOT ran out of places to go.  Time to have the final battle and be done with the book.  Themes like the Prince of Dorne fighting the Mountain.  That was awesome.  Just be done with it, don't just ramble along until Grey Worm is deciding the fate of the main character.  Okay, if you actually develop Grey Worm maybe half as much as you developed Jon Snow. 

 

Anyway, the TV show was great/one of tv's best until they ran out of material from the book to follow.  I'll go back and watch season 1-the end, it's that good.  But the energy and connection to the show ends where the books end.

its from the onion... My goodness you really are the board idiot.

[CreepingDeath]

10 minutes ago, Number9 said:

Well, that sucks.  Blame us for not liking what they came up with.  GRRM should have finished the books, plain and simple.  I think the story outgrew him.  If you have ever tried to write a book, it's easy to start one.  Then you have to deal with character development and the ending.  You kind of have to have an ending to reach and I don't know that Martin accepted any of his endings.  The story just kept growing.  

 

The last of the books I read was kinda boring and lost a lot of the old flavor, swashbuckle and intrigue the characters had in the first books.  It moved to an entirely different place and was too damn long for the story it told.  GRRM just got lost.  I think possibly he tried to milk money out of his great creation, probably fearing he couldn't write more.  I'm going to see the Tolkien movie just to see how they present his creative genius' development.  

 

So, the reason the viewing audience changed is because they went past what GRRM created.  He's human, but I think he should have ended it by book four.  Verses King's Dark Tower, GOT ran out of places to go.  Time to have the final battle and be done with the book.  Themes like the Prince of Dorne fighting the Mountain.  That was awesome.  Just be done with it, don't just ramble along until Grey Worm is deciding the fate of the main character.  Okay, if you actually develop Grey Worm maybe half as much as you developed Jon Snow. 

 

Anyway, the TV show was great/one of tv's best until they ran out of material from the book to follow.  I'll go back and watch season 1-the end, it's that good.  But the energy and connection to the show ends where the books end.

How does that Onion taste?

 

Someone put up their own epilogue on Reddit.  The apologist will treat it as gospel as it gives needed weight to the resolution.

 

[Number9]

5 minutes ago, oldschool said:

its from the onion... My goodness you really are the board idiot.

And you really are a piece of shit.  You try to cut into people for I guess your own amusement.  Thank God I don't have to live with you or spend time around you.

[Jamalisms]

7 minutes ago, CreepingDeath said:

How does that Onion taste?

 

Someone put up their own epilogue on Reddit.  The apologist will treat it as gospel as it gives needed weight to the resolution.

 

That's pretty darn good

[Jamalisms]

I keep thinking about this tweet I saw last night and laughing. And then being sad.

 

 

[NashvilleNinja]

 

[Jonboy]

Ok this is awesome. 

 

[9 Nines]

モダンライト・コンセント ポンパレ 収納付きベッドモデラス ...

[woolfolksunclesuncle]

2 hours ago, CreepingDeath said:

How does that Onion taste?

 

Someone put up their own epilogue on Reddit.  The apologist will treat it as gospel as it gives needed weight to the resolution.

 

This story and completion is well done and far better than  anything D&D could conjure. But, holy-fucking-medieval-fair-masturbation.....what a fucking dork.