AJClown Posted July 29, 2021 Report Share Posted July 29, 2021 29 minutes ago, abenjami said: And why are they only talking about forgiving federal student loans? Why not also pay for non-federal student loans? Because while the federal government has the power, in theory, to forgive debt that it backed and that is owed to the government, the federal government has no authority to tell private lenders or anyone else to forgive loans. And the vast majority of student loans are federally backed. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
abenjami Posted July 29, 2021 Report Share Posted July 29, 2021 4 minutes ago, unauthorizedcinnamon said: Because while the federal government has the power, in theory, to forgive debt that it backed and that is owed to the government, the federal government has no authority to tell private lenders or anyone else to forgive loans. And the vast majority of student loans are federally backed. Read more carefully. I didn't say force private lenders to forgive debt. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Titans279 Posted July 29, 2021 Report Share Posted July 29, 2021 1 hour ago, abenjami said: And why are they only talking about forgiving federal student loans? Why not also pay for non-federal student loans? I think Warren's plan did cover private loans to some extent. I would guess that many legislative plans do address them somehow. Schumer wants Biden to take executive action which can't cover private loans. Biden says he can't even do the federal loans anyway. I suspect neither of them actually want to do it and they're both just saying the other should do it to deflect blame. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongTimeFan Posted July 29, 2021 Report Share Posted July 29, 2021 1 hour ago, luvyablue256 said: Oh, I dunno, maybe because other forms of debt aren't needed to attain gainful employment and contribute to the economy? People who graduated with degrees in demand have gainful employment and shouldn't need help. The other idiots that got degrees in art appreciation or some other worthless degree shouldn't have loan forgiveness because they have already shown they don't know the value of money and will just get into some other debt. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
luvyablue256 Posted July 29, 2021 Author Report Share Posted July 29, 2021 15 minutes ago, LongTimeFan said: People who graduated with degrees in demand have gainful employment and shouldn't need help. The other idiots that got degrees in art appreciation or some other worthless degree shouldn't have loan forgiveness because they have already shown they don't know the value of money and will just get into some other debt. What's the average debt of an engineer that graduated in the last 8-10 years? What's the average salary? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
reo Posted July 29, 2021 Report Share Posted July 29, 2021 (edited) 2 hours ago, abenjami said: You mean like small business loans that people use to start businesses? Or what about the tons of credit card debts college students amass because their student loans only pay for tuition/books and don't cover food, etc.? Not mutually exclusive. Make the case. I'm of the mind that an educated society is of benefit beyond economic reasons and yet the cost of education compared to the increase in available income with that education is not economically viable to a lot of people. Costs more than they get out of it. So if you want people to continue to seek higher education, the ratio needs to improve in the long term. In the short term those with massive student loan debt that they will never be able to pay off could be forgiven. In the long term other options should be researched. Edited July 29, 2021 by reo Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongTimeFan Posted July 29, 2021 Report Share Posted July 29, 2021 19 minutes ago, luvyablue256 said: What's the average debt of an engineer that graduated in the last 8-10 years? What's the average salary? Don't know. I know my friends son just graduate from Texas A&M and got a job offer of $93,000. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Rogue Posted July 29, 2021 Popular Post Report Share Posted July 29, 2021 I’m not a student debt forgiveness fan. While I do think the cost of education is rediculous and in need of reform, which is another subject, they signed on for what they signed on for. I’m totally about discussing education costs and solutions, but those that signed on, have signed on. It’s their debt to pay back as far as I’m concerned. CaliTitan3518, abenjami, Little Earl, and 3 others 6 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
titanruss Posted July 29, 2021 Report Share Posted July 29, 2021 5 hours ago, LongTimeFan said: Why single out just student loans? The people who didn't go to college and have a mortgage, or other debt, should that be forgiven? Theres also the people like me that paid off like 65k+ in loans. do we get a percentage back? they should reform the system. In response to their predatory practices, possibly penalize the loan companies or force them into lower apr or find ways to greatly reduce defaulting. Thats not forgiving the loans but it opens the market for safer practices while helping those more vulnerable and uneducated to the loan/debt system. chef, and abenjami 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
abenjami Posted July 29, 2021 Report Share Posted July 29, 2021 I think some of the existing mechanisms for student loan relief are good for society. For example, teachers are (or were) able to get $5k of their student loans forgiven as a thank you for going into public school teaching. Some portion of law school loans are (or used to be) forgiven for lawyers who take jobs for less than something like $50k per year at non-profits that provide free legal services to poor people. I'm fine with stuff like that. It makes a ton of sense to provide some financial assistance to those who are willing to use their degree working in ways that benefit the community. But a free wipe the slate clean across the board for some people and not others? No way, that's ridiculous. titanruss, and chef 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
abenjami Posted July 29, 2021 Report Share Posted July 29, 2021 2 hours ago, reo said: Not mutually exclusive. Make the case. I'm of the mind that an educated society is of benefit beyond economic reasons and yet the cost of education compared to the increase in available income with that education is not economically viable to a lot of people. Costs more than they get out of it. So if you want people to continue to seek higher education, the ratio needs to improve in the long term. In the short term those with massive student loan debt that they will never be able to pay off could be forgiven. In the long term other options should be researched. What is your case for wiping the slate clean for a college student who got federal student loans but doing nothing for a similar college student who ended up with private loans or credit card debt to pay for the same education? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJClown Posted July 29, 2021 Report Share Posted July 29, 2021 8 hours ago, abenjami said: Read more carefully. I didn't say force private lenders to forgive debt. It's certainly strongly implied in "the federal government has the power Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldschool Posted July 29, 2021 Report Share Posted July 29, 2021 5 hours ago, Rogue said: I’m not a student debt forgiveness fan. While I do think the cost of education is rediculous and in need of reform, which is another subject, they signed on for what they signed on for. I’m totally about discussing education costs and solutions, but those that signed on, have signed on. It’s their debt to pay back as far as I’m concerned. I couldn't agree more. I went to Maryland for one year and then transferred to GW to finish undergrad and my masters. My wife got her masters as well. We both had a ton of student debt and didn't get high paying jobs right after college. Somehow we managed to payoff our student loans by 30. You know how? Not buying a house right a way, not buying expensive cars; basically not living above our means. The real issue is to address the absurd costs of higher education over the past 15+ years. It's out of control and needs to be addressed. A one time forgiveness of student loan debt is a classic case of wanting to treat the symptom instead of the cause. abenjami, chef, and TF_Titan 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
abenjami Posted July 29, 2021 Report Share Posted July 29, 2021 4 hours ago, unauthorizedcinnamon said: It's certainly strongly implied in "the federal government has the power I didn't say "the federal government has the power" to forgive private debt. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 29, 2021 Report Share Posted July 29, 2021 9 hours ago, abenjami said: I think some of the existing mechanisms for student loan relief are good for society. For example, teachers are (or were) able to get $5k of their student loans forgiven as a thank you for going into public school teaching. Some portion of law school loans are (or used to be) forgiven for lawyers who take jobs for less than something like $50k per year at non-profits that provide free legal services to poor people. I'm fine with stuff like that. It makes a ton of sense to provide some financial assistance to those who are willing to use their degree working in ways that benefit the community. But a free wipe the slate clean across the board for some people and not others? No way, that's ridiculous. I agree here, although I am not opposed to generally wiping the slate clean to stimulate the economy and as an acknowledgment that students loans and the cost of education became extremely predatory and this would be akin to a bailout. We've seen government bailouts and government funds directed all over the place--why not something that for once would help a wide range of ordinary Americans? None of this happening in a vacuum. To the original post quoted here, an easy to apply for and get loan forgiveness for people that serve the public good would be fantastic. It's absurd the number of teachers I know that had to rack up debt to take on a sub $50k lifetime job to do a job that is vastly underrated by society. The amount of cost saved just by the basic childcare school provide alone should make folks want to help teachers. I think the best plan would be to reform the system and look into public service jobs that are underpaid. If you want to be a teacher, a social worker, or a police officer (PLEASE let's get more educated cops), you shouldn't have any debt as far as I am concerned. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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