Untold: The Testimony of Vince Young(The story of a Dullard)

[japan]

10 hours ago, NashvilleNinja said:

It's more of a fluff piece that leaned a little more into VY's favor, but Fisher's character is laid out. He's just a duplicitous, self-centered piece of shit. His answers about refusing to answer VY's letter, and Bo Scaife's and LenDale White's commentary just serve to confirm it. I would like to believe he wasn't actively trying to cause him to fail, but he never wanted him in the first place so wouldn't his failure only serve to confirm his stance on not drafting VY?

 

VY was 100% responsible for his own failures, obviously. But he was a 22 year old coddled ass Texas U superstar at the time who had just won one of the greatest national title games of all time and was made the 3rd overall pick in the draft right after. The guy was drowning in a sea of adulation, enablement, and immaturity.

 

Fisher had his work cut out for him and he was pissed off that workload was forced on him in the first place. Fisher could have done the opposite of what he did. He could have been the father figure VY obviously needed. Maybe it wouldn't have worked anyway. But instead he chooses the path that included cops and a photographer to frame up a suicide story that he leaked to the media? Who tf does that? He was there to take the ride (and credit) if VY had panned out, but he was even more ready to bail and help speed the failure up first chance he got. Win/win in his mind.

 

Fisher and VY were a shotgun marriage that never had a snowball's chance in hell of succeeding. And neither had much of a career after they left here.

VY was an extraordinary POS and quit on the team and Fisher multiple times. I’m sure Fisher is bitter about it…

Edited yesterday at 12:25 PM by japan

[NashvilleNinja]

9 hours ago, titanruss said:

Its not lost on me that the same year he's caught manipulating his wife and cheating on her and she leaves him... that he's also manipulating the media and fans while actively scheming to ruin a guys life that he's supposed to be coaching... and he's also (tandom lol) skydiving into practice to try and look like everything is OK. 

 

I thought the Deanna Carter thing happened years before VY? Or was he messing around with others?

 

9 hours ago, titanruss said:

 

One of the most eye-opening things of my life - seeing how easily manipulated people are the day he put on that manning jersey. On what planet is it ok to do a shit job coaching, then put o a rivals jersey and say "i want to feel like a winner?" - and have half the crowd think its the most delightful and funny shit ever. Dude should have been fired immediately. 

 

It's not on par with Vrabel publicly fellating Robert Kraft while he was still the Titans coach, but it's not far. It's fucking hilarious that after Fisher was forced to start VY after the BYE they went on the winning streak after starting 0-6.

[NashvilleNinja]

51 minutes ago, japan said:

VY was an extraordinary POS and quit on the team and Fisher multiple times. I’m sure Fisher is bitter about it…

 

VY may have quit on Fisher, but Fisher never even started with VY. Of course Fisher had a right to be pissed about Adams meddlesome ass demanding they draft VY over the guy he wanted. but Fisher had a mandate to coach the team he was given and he decided to be manipulative and play games with VY.

 

Maybe you can argue that he was just speeding up an inevitability outcome with VY if you want, but it's still bush league pettiness and Fisher thinking he was bigger and better than he actually was. He and VY had a LOT in common that way.

[japan]

49 minutes ago, NashvilleNinja said:

 

VY may have quit on Fisher, but Fisher never even started with VY. Of course Fisher had a right to be pissed about Adams meddlesome ass demanding they draft VY over the guy he wanted. but Fisher had a mandate to coach the team he was given and he decided to be manipulative and play games with VY.

 

Maybe you can argue that he was just speeding up an inevitability outcome with VY if you want, but it's still bush league pettiness and Fisher thinking he was bigger and better than he actually was. He and VY had a LOT in common that way.

Wish Fisher had decided to coach him up.  He could have won rookie of the year!

[cenj]

4 hours ago, OILERMAN said:

 

I'm not disagreeing with a lot of your post and Fisher did come off poorly, more petty. 

 

But using Scaife and White to confirm VY's side of things would hardly represent proof of how "everyone" in the locker room saw Fisher. You can throw in his sisters and mom too. Not exactly impartial people.

 

Oh, I agree. I didn't mean the locker room (every coach has players that support them), I meant everyone involved on the "documentary."

 

Certainly friends and family are biased towards VY.  Lendale was also criticized for being fat and lazy too, partying too much and drinking his tequila. Scaife comes across as pretty reasonable, being someone who played with VY in both college and the pros and who knew the difference in VY under different coaches, but he's obviously too close of a friend.

 

I have no idea if the producers purposely aimed to craft Fisher into the villain of the story just for storytelling purposes, or if through speaking to everyone around they felt he was a villain.  But they definitely painted a picture of a college coach who was empathetic and supportive and got a smart, hardworking VY.

 

In contrast, they left a ton of breadcrumbs to insinuate that Fisher was a petty, ego-driven HC who wanted VY to fail, and actively tried to speed up that failure. They cast Fisher as a backstabbing saboteur who purposely created a culture of distrust. They even left crumbs to insinuate that  Fisher's ego was threatened by VY's cultural popularity. 

 

I'm not saying all that is true; it's just how the producers presented the story. They easily could have showed all the things Fisher did to support VY and develop him, but they chose not to.

[cenj]

Another thing...

 

VY has a wife, large family, people who love him from Texas. The fact that he was unable to lean on all those positive people in his life and instead flipped out anytime he was criticized by a male authority is odd.

 

He could of said that all the BS early on screwed up his development and that he wasn't given the time or opportunity to develop after TN. That the distractions were too much, that he couldn't handle it. Instead, he gives weak excuses like he's being cut because teams didn't want to associate with his baggage? That's ridiculous. He just wasn't good enough at that point.

 

A small detail that I did notice, and this may be looking way too much into this: his family noted that in HS, kids who used to make fun of him started being his friend when he got notoriety as a QB. The dude was a starting QB, super big and athletic. Guys like that don't tend to get picked on, even if they aren't nationally known. It did make me wonder about his personality -- that his peers smelled weakness in him despite his physical gifts.

Edited yesterday at 04:11 PM by cenj

[abenjami]

"Can't nobody tell me nothin!"

[TF_Titan]

14 hours ago, nine said:

...but it also leaves a bit of a bad taste in your mouth for both Vince and Fisher.

 

I already have a bad taste in my mouth when it comes to both of them.

[TF_Titan]

Fisher and Vrabel share a lot of the same strengths and flaws.

[kgsTitan]

1 hour ago, abenjami said:

"Can't nobody tell me nothin!"

 

This right here is the one thing that pissed me off at the time and still does...the way 60 minutes intentionally took that out of context and everyone ran with it. He said it in response to people saying he can't achieve his goals - - belief in himself. NOT, as in I won't listen to someone trying to help me. 

That was a 100% intentional twisting of his words.  I remember being stunned by how negative the framing was on the 60 mins piece when it aired, and seemed like a real turning point of public perception.  It almost ran like a hit piece.

 

Somehow, not agreeing with naysayers made him an arrogant piece of shit:

 

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/the-invincible-vince-young/

Asked if he's going to the playoffs, Young tells Pelley, "We working on it right now. I wanna say, you know, I'm not trying to predict it right now. But how we looking right now, we have a big shot at it."

"People have told you to calm down on your predictions, haven't they?" Pelley asks.

"No," Young says, laughing.

"No?" Pelley asks.

Says Young, "Can't nobody tell me nothing."

Edited 23 hours ago by kgsTitan

[titanruss]

3 hours ago, NashvilleNinja said:

 

I thought the Deanna Carter thing happened years before VY? Or was he messing around with others?

 

 

It's not on par with Vrabel publicly fellating Robert Kraft while he was still the Titans coach, but it's not far. It's fucking hilarious that after Fisher was forced to start VY after the BYE they went on the winning streak after starting 0-6.

 

The divorce/separation happened at the beginning of the same year that Fisher made up the VY missing  and media thing. 

 

 

[titanruss]

4 hours ago, japan said:

VY was an extraordinary POS and quit on the team and Fisher multiple times. I’m sure Fisher is bitter about it…

 

Have we listed all the times VY "quit"? Here's what I've seen... 

 

One was in the Chargers playoff game... and he didnt quit nor even miss a play. 

One was the Jaguars game where Jeff told all his media buds that VY didn't want to go in... but it later came out that he was benched after the bad start. Then he was put back in later where he got injured and this is closely related to....

The made up media frenzy by Fisher where VY didnt quit or run away. 

 

The final one was him walking off the field and throwing his pads into the stands (after being told to go to the locker room) .... after 4 years of Fisher trying to sabotage him, VY has been having a solid season. VY injures a finger and Jeff immediately benches him. iVY begs to go in... but Jeff wont let him and sends him to the locker room. So how do you quit when you are benched and told to go to the locker room after begging to play? 

 

The narrative from Fisher and Nashville media that you were sold is 99% bullshit. ... the same as the "cant tell me nothin" clarification from the post above. 

 

 

 

 

[TF_Titan]

11 minutes ago, titanruss said:

One was the Jaguars game where Jeff told all his media buds that VY didn't want to go in... but it later came out that he was benched after the bad start. Then he was put back in later where he got injured and this is closely related to....

 

This is factually incorrect. Again...I was right there. I saw the whole thing. He absolutely ran over to the bench and refused to go back in. The coaches were scrambling around trying to find him and they literally had to shove him onto the field. That's 100% what happened. He wasn't benched. He didn't miss a play until he got hurt later.

[titanruss]

1 hour ago, TF_Titan said:

 

This is factually incorrect. Again...I was right there. I saw the whole thing. He absolutely ran over to the bench and refused to go back in. The coaches were scrambling around trying to find him and they literally had to shove him onto the field. That's 100% what happened. He wasn't benched. He didn't miss a play until he got hurt later.

 

Ok then I was using googleAi to help me recall. I believe you more than the media and that shitty ai. 

 

Yeah, it was weak, but he did go back into the game without missing a rep. I guess i just define quitting as quitting. Not almost quitting or having trouble dealing. 

VY didnt have the mindset to be a long term success in this league. I'll agree on that. 

Edited 22 hours ago by titanruss

[cenj]

1 hour ago, titanruss said:

 

Have we listed all the times VY "quit"? Here's what I've seen... 

 

To add to the Jags one mentioned above...

 

2) UT. He quit when they let the backup QB run a play. He literally got in his car and said in the documentary that he had decided he was done with Texas. McNair called him and said (paraphrased from his friend in the doc), "what we don't do is quit." 

 

3) Throwing the pads into the stands. Even in the doc, Scaife and Lendale said that VY made it known to all the guys that he was quitting on Fisher, "not his teammates." But by their accounts and VY's own admission in the documentary, VY decided he was done with Fisher. The result was that Fisher barred him from the facility after Bud Adams finally agreed it was time to part ways.

Edited 22 hours ago by cenj