Trump Indicted By DC Grand Jury

[begooode]

21 minutes ago, reo said:

 

This should be common knowledge by now 

And this is why I’ll always hate Jeff Clark as much as anyone connected with Trump. He singlehandedly was willing to compromise the entire DOJ and knowingly commit crimes against the constitution in service to Trump’s coup attempt. Trump cannot even feign plausible deniability (my lawyers told me, blah, blah,..) because everyone at that level told Trump that his voter fraud claims were baseless, and he had to go 3 levels down to find Clark to go in on his plot.

 

Additionally, Trump DID promote his complicit toady, so he can’t minimize it (no harm, no foul). Trump demanded that false letter of voting irregularities be sent, and gave the guy the authority to do it overriding all of DOJ leadership.

 

I’m glad this October surprise from Jack Smith is not a bunch of bullshit, but rather a demand that the nation evaluates exactly how much of an unrepentant criminal Trump really is. 

[OILERMAN]

Jeffery Clark def one of the worst 

[Titandan]

4 hours ago, ChesterCopperpot1 said:

Nixon was going to be prosecuted before Ford pardoned him. 
 

immunity is not endless. It applies to only acts within the scope of the office, like Obama and his drone strikes. 
 

trump trying to steal an election to cling to power is not within the scope of his office. 

What you guys are alleging Trump of doing on January 6th happened while he was in office, no?  

Trump was exploring all options at that point because there was a lot of suspicious activity and he ended up leaving the office when the time of transition took place.  The other "convictions" happened years or decades before Trump took office.  Such a coincidence that they decided to prosecute him all at once right before election year.  Your hatred for the guy has clouded your reasoning ability.  

It's a double standard period. 

Nothing more than a witch hunt.  Don't come at me with that shit. 

[Jamalisms]

3 hours ago, Jamalisms said:

Misinformation propaganda bot go brrrr.

 

[WG53]

@Titandanis either a paid Russian asset or just one of the dumbest individuals alive.

[Titandan]

4 hours ago, Mythos27 said:

The Trump tower meeting WAS collusion. The only thing that stopped the conspiracy was the Russians having nothing. Had the the Russian had the goods and Trump used it, that would've been prosecutable. Trump's people taking that meeting was improper and collusion in and of itself. What an innocent campaign would've done was refuse to meet with a hostile foreign power offering information that was intended to affect our election. My analogy works perfectly because it demonstrates the willingness to do something wrong and only being stopped by the other party. It demonstrates how open to corruption Trump is which should not be surprising to anyone not in complete denial. 

How about making up crimes then using those fake allegations to stream hit piece story after hit piece on CNN and MSNBC for months before and after election year.  Forcing a report and investigation and wasting millions in tax payer money for something that you know you made up.  What's that called? 

Let's do another scenario.  Let's say I was suspicious of rival business.  Even though, in my mind, they have an inferior product, they are slowly taking more and more of my market share.  Then someone comes to me and says that they know the unfair advantage that my rival is using to destroy my business.  Would it be wrong of me to take that meeting even if that guy was a delusional idiot who actually had nothing of substance? 

I take the meeting, dismiss the guy, and don't do anything to harm my rival business.  How is that collusion?  

Collusion necessitates working with a partner to illegally defraud or cheat someone.

Even if the Russian person had dirt on Hillary, if it was bullshit allegations or something about the information was illegal in nature, there's a good chance that Trump Jr would not have taken the bait. If the dirt was legitimate and Trump Jr found corroborating evidence, I don't think that's collusion. They would not have defrauded anyone or cheated anyone. If anything, that "dirt" would have given the American people a clearer picture of who they were voting for just like Stormy, Grab 'em by the pussy, and E. Jean Carroll gave the people plenty of reason not to vote for Trump. None of which were consequential to the average American life. 

Like I said, TRUTH is all that matters. 

[Titandan]

Just now, WG53 said:

@Titandanis either a paid Russian asset or just one of the dumbest individuals alive.

Why not all of the above?  

So did we so easily give up on the whole theory that I'm this Ben character? 

[WG53]

Gets directed to Republicans own report that verifies collusion did indeed happen. 

 

Ignores it and denies it exists.

 

 

Yep, either willfully stupid or a paid asset.

Edited October 4, 2024 by WG53

[Mythos27]

12 minutes ago, Titandan said:

How about making up crimes then using those fake allegations to stream hit piece story after hit piece on CNN and MSNBC for months before and after election year.  Forcing a report and investigation and wasting millions in tax payer money for something that you know you made up.  What's that called? 

Let's do another scenario.  Let's say I was suspicious of rival business.  Even though, in my mind, they have an inferior product, they are slowly taking more and more of my market share.  Then someone comes to me and says that they know the unfair advantage that my rival is using to destroy my business.  Would it be wrong of me to take that meeting even if that guy was a delusional idiot who actually had nothing of substance? 

I take the meeting, dismiss the guy, and don't do anything to harm my rival business.  How is that collusion?  

Collusion necessitates working with a partner to illegally defraud or cheat someone.

Even if the Russian person had dirt on Hillary, if it was bullshit allegations or something about the information was illegal in nature, there's a good chance that Trump Jr would not have taken the bait. If the dirt was legitimate and Trump Jr found corroborating evidence, I don't think that's collusion. They would not have defrauded anyone or cheated anyone. If anything, that "dirt" would have given the American people a clearer picture of who they were voting for just like Stormy, Grab 'em by the pussy, and E. Jean Carroll gave the people plenty of reason not to vote for Trump. None of which were consequential to the average American life. 

Like I said, TRUTH is all that matters. 

Your scenario doesn't work. In what actually happened, the biggest issue is that Trump was trying to enlist aid from a foreign power that is hostile to the U.S. Allowing a foreign power to influence the election through your campaign is the problem. That's the betrayal and fraud upon the American people. He was attempting to win an election on the back of ill-gotten gains. Where the information comes from and how you get it absolutely matters in politics. That's the part that you keep glossing over. If the Trump tower meeting was with some U.S.-based group it would be a non-story but that's not what happened. Your definition of collusion is correct and it's exactly what Trump was doing. If the pee pee tape was real and Hillary attempted to procure it via a meeting with say Ukraine, you and your ilk would've been shitting yourselves in rage and you would've been right to. You guys just have a hard time seeing that one of the most obviously corrupt people in American history is corrupt and your benefit of the doubt for him is endless. There isn't a single politician I give that much grace to. 

 

Oh and btw, the amount of things that Trump gets rightfully shit on for pales in comparison to the amount of stuff he's done that he's faced little to no scrutiny for. The motherfucker purposely stiffed people who did jobs for him knowing that they wouldn't sue his ass because it would actually lose money on the balance in the end. That's the guy y'all give the benefit of the doubt to...

Edited October 4, 2024 by Mythos27

[ChemEngr79]

1 minute ago, WG53 said:

Gets directed to Republicans own report that verifies collusion did indeed happen. 

 

Ignores it and denies it exists.

 

 

Yep, either willfully stupid or a paid asset.

 

Given the proximity to the election coupled with the known Kremlin ramp-up in FUD...I suspect this is likely a paid actor and we should ignore and stop quoting.

[Mythos27]

31 minutes ago, Titandan said:

What you guys are alleging Trump of doing on January 6th happened while he was in office, no?  

Trump was exploring all options at that point because there was a lot of suspicious activity and he ended up leaving the office when the time of transition took place.  The other "convictions" happened years or decades before Trump took office.  Such a coincidence that they decided to prosecute him all at once right before election year.  Your hatred for the guy has clouded your reasoning ability.  

It's a double standard period. 

Nothing more than a witch hunt.  Don't come at me with that shit. 

There was no suspicious activity. He just knew he could make you guys think it was suspicious and that you would all literally flush democracy down the told on little more than his word. Well he was right about that at least. 

[Titandan]

4 hours ago, Mythos27 said:

Doesn't mean I like it. I thought it was criminal when Obama drone stirked an American citizen. I thought Bush committed war crimes. I understand that presidents need a little latitude to do the job but they should not feel emboldened to do whatever the fuck they want, regardless of how illegal it might be. No one is above the law. 

I actually understand why Obama did what he did. 

There's a chance that Bush really was misled by the CIA and Cheney.  

And Bill boy was just gifted with extra powerful libido that Shrillary just couldn't keep up with. 

But why not give Trump the benefit of the doubt as well?  

Like I said, I'm pretty trusting of most presidents because I haven't been in their situation.  I only remember Bush and Obama's elections before Trump.  All of the elections that I've been a part of were called the night of or the morning after. The whole hanging chad thing was a controversy but even that was resolved after the election was called. 

If the shoe was on the other foot, and let's say Obama was gaining a lot of traction.  His rallies were energetic and there was a lot of enthusiasm around him.  Tens of thousands came to his rallies on a daily basis. 

And let's say McCain's rallies attracted only a couple hundred people and most people fell asleep when he talked.  Let's say that McCain was barely doing any rallies at that and he hid in his basement almost the whole time he was running.  

Then election day comes along and Obama was easily winning.  5 of the 7 swing states that he needed were in his favor by the end of election night.  But suddenly the vote counts freeze and refreshing the election page is not revealing any updates on votes.  So you go to sleep and then the next morning, McCain almost caught up to Obama in 3-5 states that Obama was handily winning.  

Then the next day, McCain was now winning the 3 states and the other 2 states, he was catching up.  In the next couple days, you realize that McCain got the record most votes in American history and easily beat Obama in popular votes and electoral votes. 

Don't you think you'd be at least a little bit suspicious of these events? 

I say this as someone who refused to vote for McCain.  I think he was probably the worst Republican nominee in my lifetime.  Back then I cared about character and I really did not like the way he ditched his wife after the war.  But whatever...  I empathize with Trump's post election situation because I found a whole lot of 2020 election to be super suspicious.  I'm not saying I have proof of enough fraud to overturn the election.  But there definitely was fraud and that's why I'm saying we should do whatever we can to make this election as fraud proof as possible.  

Anyway, I'm being long winded again.  I'll stop here. 

[begooode]

8 minutes ago, WG53 said:

@Titandanis either a paid Russian asset or just one of the dumbest individuals alive.

I’m guessing they see themselves as very clever, and Trump’s a unique and unrepentant political figure for them to flex aggressively and peacock their regressive ideals. More lulz at the Libs, cuz Trump, than anything else. It surely has nothing to do with character of the office, American exceptionalism, or global leadership. Assholery ftw!

[Mythos27]

Just now, Titandan said:

I actually understand why Obama did what he did. 

There's a chance that Bush really was misled by the CIA and Cheney.  

And Bill boy was just gifted with extra powerful libido that Shrillary just couldn't keep up with. 

But why not give Trump the benefit of the doubt as well?  

Like I said, I'm pretty trusting of most presidents because I haven't been in their situation.  I only remember Bush and Obama's elections before Trump.  All of the elections that I've been a part of were called the night of or the morning after. The whole hanging chad thing was a controversy but even that was resolved after the election was called. 

If the shoe was on the other foot, and let's say Obama was gaining a lot of traction.  His rallies were energetic and there was a lot of enthusiasm around him.  Tens of thousands came to his rallies on a daily basis. 

And let's say McCain's rallies attracted only a couple hundred people and most people fell asleep when he talked.  Let's say that McCain was barely doing any rallies at that and he hid in his basement almost the whole time he was running.  

Then election day comes along and Obama was easily winning.  5 of the 7 swing states that he needed were in his favor by the end of election night.  But suddenly the vote counts freeze and refreshing the election page is not revealing any updates on votes.  So you go to sleep and then the next morning, McCain almost caught up to Obama in 3-5 states that Obama was handily winning.  

Then the next day, McCain was now winning the 3 states and the other 2 states, he was catching up.  In the next couple days, you realize that McCain got the record most votes in American history and easily beat Obama in popular votes and electoral votes. 

Don't you think you'd be at least a little bit suspicious of these events? 

I say this as someone who refused to vote for McCain.  I think he was probably the worst Republican nominee in my lifetime.  Back then I cared about character and I really did not like the way he ditched his wife after the war.  But whatever...  I empathize with Trump's post election situation because I found a whole lot of 2020 election to be super suspicious.  I'm not saying I have proof of enough fraud to overturn the election.  But there definitely was fraud and that's why I'm saying we should do whatever we can to make this election as fraud proof as possible.  

Anyway, I'm being long winded again.  I'll stop here. 

The reason I don't "give Trump the benefit of the doubt as well" is because I didn't give the others the benefit of the doubt either. That's the beauty of having principles outside of what is convenient for you; it allows you to be logically. morally consistent rather than an opportunistic hypocrite. It's what I base my world view on. I can accept extenuating circumstances and material differences but I'm always going to try to be as objective as I can be. 

[Titandan]

1 minute ago, Mythos27 said:

There was no suspicious activity. He just knew he could make you guys think it was suspicious and that you would all literally flush democracy down the told on little more than his word. Well he was right about that at least. 

You haven't heard of dead people voting? 
No voter ID requirement in voting
Multiple ballots being cast in different states for the same person

Again, I'm not saying I have proof that we have enough of this activity to overturn the election. Just saying there was definitely suspicious activity going on.