Kentucky Voter Suppression

[OzTitan]

1 hour ago, Daqueef said:

Mail in ballots is as secure as any other system.

 

Pretty much. And unless I'm missing something, it is at least still physical, so there is a way to extensively audit it after the fact.

 

Mass fraud via mail in votes is just not a realistic threat.

[OzTitan]

Actually in fairness saying mail ballots is as secure as any other system is like saying any technology is secure or insecure. It comes down to what you do to mitigate the threats.

 

Obviously if the mail in voting system was "just write down who you want to vote for and send it in, you can supply the paper and write it how you want", then that's very insecure.

 

In reality you can employ a whole host of counter measures to improve on that. You can easily control the supply of the forms/paper used to vote, mitigating against unlimited votes. To prevent reproducing/copying, you of course have a whole host of mitigations - stuff like what is used to protect cash from being counterfeit, EURion constellations, etc. Then you have a whole field of statistical analysis after the fact to identify issues. Identity fraud that attacks the assumption of having a right to receive a mail ballot is what I would consider out of scope since the same attack applies to other already accepted forms of voting.

 

The idea isn't to stop every instance of voter fraud, it's to prevent mass fraud by a nation state or well resourced bad actor. Arguably just one electoral college outcome changed has potential to impact the election, but that's still a lot of fraud. You won't have completely fraud proof voting until human identities are tightly linked to electronic identities and voting involves cryptographic proof of a valid vote.

 

I'm not across whether mitigations are in place or sufficient for mail ballots, but there's nothing fatally wrong with the protocol.

Edited June 23, 2020 by OzTitan

[luvyablue256]

1 hour ago, OzTitan said:

 

Pretty much. And unless I'm missing something, it is at least still physical, so there is a way to extensively audit it after the fact.

 

Mass fraud via mail in votes is just not a realistic threat.

Does anyone honestly trust poll workers, county election directors and secretaries of state to not defraud mailed in votes in red states?

Edited June 23, 2020 by luvyablue256

[OzTitan]

9 minutes ago, luvyablue256 said:

Does anyone honestly trust poll workers, county election directors and secretaries of state to not defraud mailed in votes in red states?

 

I'm really just looking at it specifically from a method of voting perspective. What you describe is really voting fraud at a much lower level, where almost any form of voting would be vulnerable (do we trust them to handle in-person votes securely and legitimately?).

[WG53]

2 hours ago, luvyablue256 said:

Does anyone honestly trust poll workers, county election directors and secretaries of state to not defraud mailed in votes in red states?

After what happened in North Carolina? Fuck no.

[AJClown]

Nevermind

Edited June 23, 2020 by Daqueef

[AJClown]

10 hours ago, OzTitan said:

Actually in fairness saying mail ballots is as secure as any other system is like saying any technology is secure or insecure. It comes down to what you do to mitigate the threats.

 

Obviously if the mail in voting system was "just write down who you want to vote for and send it in, you can supply the paper and write it how you want", then that's very insecure.

 

In reality you can employ a whole host of counter measures to improve on that. You can easily control the supply of the forms/paper used to vote, mitigating against unlimited votes. To prevent reproducing/copying, you of course have a whole host of mitigations - stuff like what is used to protect cash from being counterfeit, EURion constellations, etc. Then you have a whole field of statistical analysis after the fact to identify issues. Identity fraud that attacks the assumption of having a right to receive a mail ballot is what I would consider out of scope since the same attack applies to other already accepted forms of voting.

 

The idea isn't to stop every instance of voter fraud, it's to prevent mass fraud by a nation state or well resourced bad actor. Arguably just one electoral college outcome changed has potential to impact the election, but that's still a lot of fraud. You won't have completely fraud proof voting until human identities are tightly linked to electronic identities and voting involves cryptographic proof of a valid vote.

 

I'm not across whether mitigations are in place or sufficient for mail ballots, but there's nothing fatally wrong with the protocol.

Until you can give us significant instances of "harvest balloting," we will continue to ignore you.

[Come on Titans]

Trump & Barr know the fraud claims are bullshit....most every reasonably intelligent person knows it's BS. 

It's thinly veiled voter suppression & an excuse to claim he was cheated when he loses

 

FACT CHECK: Trump Spreads Unfounded Claims About Voting By Mail

 

https://www.npr.org/2020/06/22/881598655/fact-check-trump-spreads-unfounded-claims-about-voting-by-mail

[luvyablue256]

34 minutes ago, Daqueef said:

Until you can give us significant instances of "harvest balloting," we will continue to ignore you.

Ballot harvesting is another boomer conspiracy dessert. Just like Antifa and other Qanon bullshit 

[pat]

 

[Number9]

5 hours ago, patsplat said:

 

Voter suppression.  How would pubs feel if this happened to them?

These people have on casual summer attire.  Would pubs show up in fatigues, carrying AK-47?

[klaatu'sAngel'sUncle]

I think they're suppressing the black vote because they want McGrath to primary Booker because he is much more progressive than Lt Col McGrath. Kentucky as a whole is only 7% black and 89% white, and almost half of all black Kentuckians live in Jefferson County. Most of the white voters would have voted Republican ticket so the black vote is critical in the KY Dem primary.

 

 

Edited June 24, 2020 by klaatu-

[luvyablue256]

8 hours ago, klaatu- said:

I think they're suppressing the black vote because they want McGrath to primary Booker because he is much more progressive than Lt Col McGrath. Kentucky as a whole is only 7% black and 89% white, and almost half of all black Kentuckians live in Jefferson County. Most of the white voters would have voted Republican ticket so the black vote is critical in the KY Dem primary.

 

 

Nah... they're suppressing the vote as a warmup for November. Just like in GA & WI