Justafan Posted March 5 Report Share Posted March 5 17 minutes ago, Callidus said: Ironically JSN is the only college wr recently whos advanced stats match up to tates. Yeah but his production isn’t in the same ballpark. Pretending like that doesn’t matter…. It’s a strategy I guess. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
titansfan Posted March 5 Report Share Posted March 5 5 minutes ago, Justafan said: Just stop. You’re embarrassing yourself. No youre embarrassing yourself. You clearly have no idea what you are talking about. Justafan 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justafan Posted March 5 Report Share Posted March 5 32 minutes ago, titansfan said: Youre too overly concerned with College numbers. It matters, but not to the level you think... As someone said AJ Green never got above a 1000 yards and he was one of the greatest WR prospects, Julio Jones barely crossed 1000 once, Puka never crossed that threshold.... College stats is actually one of the more overrated arguing points to use. Many evaluators dont care about it like you do... again its traits first and foremost. You don’t know what evaluators care about like I do! lol. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justafan Posted March 5 Report Share Posted March 5 1 minute ago, titansfan said: No youre embarrassing yourself. You clearly have no idea what you are talking about. Says the guy who just said college production doesn’t matter! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Callidus Posted March 5 Report Share Posted March 5 1 minute ago, Justafan said: Yeah but his production isn’t in the same ballpark. Pretending like that doesn’t matter…. It’s a strategy I guess. It really isn't that big of a deal. Bulk stats hardly ever tell the real story. Anyone could rush for 2000 yards if you gave them 500 touches. Look at love, his stats are nothing special compared to some backs, but his efficiency is off the charts. Im not saying they are meaningless but there is alot more nuance to this. He had probably the best wr prospect since megatron as well as two more first round wrs one of which went 4th overall to split targets with. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justafan Posted March 5 Report Share Posted March 5 Just now, Callidus said: It really isn't that big of a deal. Bulk stats hardly ever tell the real story. Anyone could rush for 2000 yards if you gave them 500 touches. Look at love, his stats are nothing special compared to some backs, but his efficiency is off the charts. Im not saying they are meaningless but there is alot more nuance to this. He had probably the best wr prospect since megatron as well as two more first round wrs one of which went 4th overall to split targets with. I’ll give you there is nuance but college production has a huge correlation to NFL success. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
titansfan Posted March 5 Report Share Posted March 5 4 minutes ago, Justafan said: Says the guy who just said college production doesn’t matter! And on top of it all you cant read or comprehend well. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
titansfan Posted March 5 Report Share Posted March 5 6 minutes ago, Justafan said: You don’t know what evaluators care about like I do! lol. I even gave you a source this time! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Callidus Posted March 5 Report Share Posted March 5 (edited) 9 minutes ago, Justafan said: I’ll give you there is nuance but college production has a huge correlation to NFL success. Depends on the position. Some are insanely intertwined, edge for example. Others like tightend it means next to nothing. The one stat for wrs that does have a really high correlation to success is breakout age. The earlier a guy has a good season the more likely they are to be good in the nfl. Edit: another funny stat that has an oddly good correlation with success is runningbacks with large hands. Edited March 5 by Callidus Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
titansfan Posted March 5 Report Share Posted March 5 (edited) 12 minutes ago, Justafan said: I’ll give you there is nuance but college production has a huge correlation to NFL success. When evaluating the stats are proof of product. So yes they do matter in the sense that production will make an evaluators feel more confident about their assessments of traits (NFL decision makers are in the risk assessment business). The production is actually just more evidence. So yes many of your best players have both top level traits AND good stats (thats why they are top players). However lack of production ≠ lack of traits. Scouts are always looking at traits, skills, and consistency first. The numbers they produced in college are very much secondary. Jamarr Chase only started one year and didn't have to play the following season because he already showed the traits (and yes had the stats to back it up, but point stands how college games dont weigh as heavily as you imagine). Travon Walker went 1st overall because he had traits. Jahmry Gibbs was a traits pick-- never got to 1000 yards in college. Stingley actually never reached production of his freshman season but went 3rd because we saw the traits when he was 19 years old. Observe traits first, not stats not Combine numbers Edited March 5 by titansfan Callidus 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
titansfan Posted March 5 Report Share Posted March 5 (edited) 12 minutes ago, Callidus said: Depends on the position. Some are insanely intertwined, edge for example. Others like tightend it means next to nothing. The one stat for wrs that does have a really high correlation to success is breakout age. The earlier a guy has a good season the more likely they are to be good in the nfl. Edit: another funny stat that has an oddly good correlation with success is runningbacks with large hands. For QBs strangely enough the stat to look at is quite commonly just the number of starts. If a QB exhibits good traits and has a high level of starts then they are going to be highly thought of Edited March 5 by titansfan Callidus 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Callidus Posted March 5 Report Share Posted March 5 2 minutes ago, titansfan said: When evaluating the stats are proof of product. So yes they do matter in the sense that production will make an evaluators feel more confident about their assessments of traits (NFL decision makers are in the risk assessment business). The production is actually just more evidence. So yes many of your best players have both top level traits AND good stats (thats why they are top players). However lack of production ≠ lack of traits. Scouts are always looking at traits, skills, and consistency first. The numbers they produced in college are very much secondary. Jamarr Chase only started one year and didn't have to play the following season because he already showed the traits (and yes had the stats to back it up, but point stands how college games dont weigh as heavily as you imagine). Travon Walker went 1st overall because he had traits. Jahmry Gibbs was a traits pick-- never got to 1000 yards in college. Stingley actually never reached production of his freshman season but went 3rd because we saw the traits when he was 19 years old. Observe traits first, not stats not Combine numbers On the flipside we can point back at corey davis. All the production you could dream of and he was just good. If Jeanty doesn't make a turn around that 2800 yard season or whatever it was is going to be pretty irrelevant as well. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
titansfan Posted March 5 Report Share Posted March 5 (edited) 3 minutes ago, Callidus said: On the flipside we can point back at corey davis. All the production you could dream of and he was just good. If Jeanty doesn't make a turn around that 2800 yard season or whatever it was is going to be pretty irrelevant as well. And the biggest thing Davis had going for him was that he was the greatest college WR producer of all time (really!)... there were many people who questioned his competition, his hands, and his ability to separate. And those concerns all proved to be valid at the NFL level Edited March 5 by titansfan ChemEngr79, and Callidus 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justafan Posted March 5 Report Share Posted March 5 14 minutes ago, Callidus said: Depends on the position. Some are insanely intertwined, edge for example. Others like tightend it means next to nothing. The one stat for wrs that does have a really high correlation to success is breakout age. The earlier a guy has a good season the more likely they are to be good in the nfl. Yes, this is why you see TEs with 200 yards receiving and 2 TDs going in the first round every year…. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justafan Posted March 5 Report Share Posted March 5 10 minutes ago, titansfan said: When evaluating the stats are proof of product. So yes they do matter in the sense that production will make an evaluators feel more confident about their assessments of traits (NFL decision makers are in the risk assessment business). The production is actually just more evidence. So yes many of your best players have both top level traits AND good stats (thats why they are top players). However lack of production ≠ lack of traits. Scouts are always looking at traits, skills, and consistency first. The numbers they produced in college are very much secondary. Jamarr Chase only started one year and didn't have to play the following season because he already showed the traits (and yes had the stats to back it up, but point stands how college games dont weigh as heavily as you imagine). Travon Walker went 1st overall because he had traits. Jahmry Gibbs was a traits pick-- never got to 1000 yards in college. Stingley actually never reached production of his freshman season but went 3rd because we saw the traits when he was 19 years old. Observe traits first, not stats not Combine numbers Have you ever wondered why your analysis after watching the tape ALWAYS aligns with what the media is saying and not what NFL evaluators actually do in the draft? My guess is probably not. Sometimes obvious answers are obvious. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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