ctm Posted October 28, 2014 Report Share Posted October 28, 2014 Good coaches get more out of their player's ability than their talent level justifies, poor coaches don't. Which side does Whiz fall on? Is he doing more with less? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
scine09 Posted October 28, 2014 Report Share Posted October 28, 2014 Arizona is absolutely stacked defensively. I can't believe anyone would even try to say that the Titans are anywhere close to the Cardinals in talent. It's night and day. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 28, 2014 Report Share Posted October 28, 2014 Good coaches get more out of their player's ability than their talent level justifies, poor coaches don't. Which side does Whiz fall on? Is he doing more with less? This is a much better question and its completely valid. I understand having a scheme and wanted to stick to it but I think Whisenhunt and Horton in particular have been a little too rigid in this respect through the first half of the season. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Come on Titans Posted October 28, 2014 Report Share Posted October 28, 2014 SuperFreak90, on 28 Oct 2014 - 11:54, said: I hope this is sarcasm. You mean to tell me you put up with Munch's shit for 3 year, and you won't give Whiz 1, c'mon man. Whiz has been to multiple Super Bowls (1) as a HC, and many as a Asst. Coach. He knows how to coach. We just have dumb, no talent players on this roster. A lot like the coach we had before. Give him time to get his kinda players in here, and we'll be better. Just be calm and patient. Some sarcasm....some truth. I knew Munch was in over his head, but at least he was .500 for his 3 year HC span. I'm not a fan of Whiz until I see progress....(and not the current accelerated backward progress) Right now, all I see is a very poorly coached team. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperFreak90 Posted October 28, 2014 Report Share Posted October 28, 2014 Some sarcasm....some truth. I knew Munch was in over his head, but at least he was .500 for his 3 year HC span. I'm not a fan of Whiz until I see progress....(and not the current accelerated backward progress) Right now, all I see is a very poorly coached team. Fair enough Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AvgJoe Posted October 28, 2014 Report Share Posted October 28, 2014 Another thing about Whisenhunt. He absolutely changed the culture in Arizona. Yeah they had a couple of down years after Warner retired but before Whisenhunt got there you could argue that they were not only the worst franchise in the NFL in all of professional sports. Since his arrival in 2006 the Cardinals have been mostly competitive, with only two losing seasons. Which is pretty impressing seeing as from 1985-2006 the Cardinals had 20 losing seasons, one .500 season and one winning season, and the winning season was a 9-7 season. Not only that, but the Cardinals had their first 10-win season under Whisenhunt since 1976. Dennis Green, a highly successful coach with the Vikings, spent three years with the Cardinals immediately before Whisenhunt's arrival. Those three years, two of which had Kurt Warner on the team, produced 6-10, 5-11 and 5-11 records. This guy is a highly successful coach both as an assistant and a head coach, knows what he is doing and in three years I am confident that most of you will agree. And if not then I'll eat crow. Excellent post. People act as if Warner was still the same guy from '99 when Whisenhunt got there. He was almost out of the league Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AvgJoe Posted October 28, 2014 Report Share Posted October 28, 2014 Here is my take: Whisenhunt is not personally tanking this season, but he is putting the wheels in motion to remove us from continued mediocrity. For years, we all have complained that "this is an 8-8 team at best." While there is not a conscious effort to lose games, Whisenhunt is going to play the young guys as much as possible and see what we have and what we need. Wreh-Wilson is a perfect example. All the times he is being left on an island and getting picked on could become invaluable to him next season. Towards the end of this year, the team hopes he steps up his play and is an excellent starter next year. Mettenberger playing is the biggest key. To settle the QB position for 3 more years for the minimum salary would be huge for this franchise, This team is finally getting a housecleaning from all things "solid" and mediocre at best. Give Whisenhunt another year to get his team in place. If we are having these same conversations in 2016, we can talk about a new HC for 2017 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
StephenIsLegend Posted October 28, 2014 Report Share Posted October 28, 2014 The one complaint I really have of Whiz thus far is that it does seem we are poorly coached and don't come to play on Sundays. I don't think we have necessarily regressed, but we certainly haven't gotten better. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mythos27 Posted October 28, 2014 Report Share Posted October 28, 2014 My only issue with Whiz is that I don't like some of his in-game coaching. I feel he lets some things pass him by and is too slow to adjust in regards to what the other team is doing. That aside I feel good about him and think he will be good for the franchise in the long run. I like the culture of discipline he is trying to establish and think it will pay dividends. We all knew this would be a year of growing pains in many ways. No matter what the staff said when they arrived any fan who's watched the NFL for some time knew the team would struggle. All I've seen from Whiz shows me that he is very serious about figuring out what is wrong with this roster and finding some answers. We knew this would be a tough year so we need to man up and take our lumps just like every team who has ever rebuilt has. There are some legitimate criticisms of Whiz but if you're coming at it from the angle of "we're losing games" I'm just going to tune you out because you are clearly missing the point of all this. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alcibiades Posted October 28, 2014 Report Share Posted October 28, 2014 To me, the key is to watch the actual plays and decide whether it is execution or coaching. So, here's my thoughts on that issue: I've seen some strange playcalling at times, such as throwing the ball when we have a lead to protect and thus letting our opponent have more time. That was odd, but I get the mentality. There should have been plays to be made there, since we were getting single coverage. Our players couldn't take advantage of it. Perhaps the coach should know this and just run the ball, or perhaps he's trying to see if his players can play. Well, they can't. And this leads to my main observation. I see a lot of plays being left on the field. I see guys running wide open as the ball sails over their heads. I see OL getting thrown aside by pass rushers, giving our QBs no chance to make a play. I see our RBs hitting a pile of defenders as soon as they get to the line. To me, that's not coaching. It's the players. Our defense is playing OK, but they are on the field too much (more snaps than any other defense in the league, apparently). Our offense is leaving plays on the field. They are there. The coaches have given them the chances. The players don't make the plays. So that's not coaching. What IS coaching? The bad challenges. That's on the coaches. The illegal formations...perhaps coaching. The penalties? Some of them are on the coaches and some are pisspoor play. Overall, I think it's the players not the coaching right now. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Number9 Posted October 28, 2014 Report Share Posted October 28, 2014 Ken Whisenhunt is not a very good head coach. He is the NFL's version of Les Miles. He looks the part and sounds the part, but his poor in-game decisions directly lead to team losses. Not unlike others before him, whether it be Ray Rhodes, Norv Turner, Romeo Crennel or Wade Phillips, he is simply an example of the Peter Principle. He is a good coordinator, but has simply being promoted to the level where he is incompetent. And he stated that he underestimated the talent level? Perhaps it is his crappy coaching that is making the talent look so horrible! Some of us have bought into that, but their are teams getting more with less talent. It's know way anyone will tell me that Cleveland has more talent than the Titans or even Arizona for that matter. What we have is a horrible coach who throws his players under the bus! I've already grown tired of his act! Throwing players under the bus got old day one. Still, it's not time to say Whiz can't get the job done. He is installing a new offense that is built to score points. He just let his rookie QB who he appears to have a lot of faith in throw the ball 41 times in his first game. We are in for some exciting football. Wycheck was on the radio this morning wondering why Whiz isn't playing smash mouth offense. He was pointing out that was Munchak's plan and that is what the personnel on hand is designed to play. Well, that plan has been changed and it's going to take time to get everybody up to speed. Also, if Frank was paying more attention he would know why they aren't running the two TE sets. He underestimated the talent level. I think any coach would look at the money and draft picks invested in the OL and expect them to be awesome. Jake. Look at the production he's gotten out of Delanie Walker. I think Wright has not been fully utilized, but I wouldn't fire him over that. Then there is the little change made to the defense. Going from the 4-3 to the 3-4 is going to take time. The defense is not as talented as the offense and has lost three starters. I think though the biggest problem is the QB. He has now started three different QBs in eight games. And even though that has been a mark against him, I think it has been justified in this case. Until the QB position is settled, we don't know how effective Whiz is going to be as a head coach. A lot of people had high praise for him when he was hired. I think we have to give it some time to see what he can really do. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
scine09 Posted October 28, 2014 Report Share Posted October 28, 2014 Wycheck was on the radio this morning wondering why Whiz isn't playing smash mouth offense. He was pointing out that was Munchak's plan and that is what the personnel on hand is designed to play. Well, that plan has been changed and it's going to take time to get everybody up to speed. Also, if Frank was paying more attention he would know why they aren't running the two TE sets. And that's the plan that gets you to 9-7, 8-8 or 7-9 with little chance to go anywhere. Whisenhunt is trying to change that. I bet had they played with the control the clock, play not to lose strategy that Fisher and Munchak loved then they'd have ended the season with 1 or 2 more wins. It would have not been a good thing for the long term prospects of the team. Again, Whisenhunt is trying to win a Super Bowl, not need 6 different things to happen in week 17 to sneak into the playoffs at 9-7. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
C_Train Posted October 28, 2014 Report Share Posted October 28, 2014 I hope this is sarcasm. You mean to tell me you put up with Munch's shit for 3 year, and you won't give Whiz 1, c'mon man. Whiz has been to multiple Super Bowls (1) as a HC, and many as a Asst. Coach. He knows how to coach. We just have dumb, no talent players on this roster. A lot like the coach we had before. Give him time to get his kinda players in here, and we'll be better. Just be calm and patient. "Give him time to get his players" Exactly. Maybe Im crazy but I dont think Whiz is exactly pulling all the tricks out of the bag to win every game simply because these guys don't fit his system. How does he get players to fit his system? Through the draft. How does he get better talent in the draft? By having a better position to select. And how does he do that? By not doing everything in his power to get a crappy team to .500 I believe the "tanking" started before the switch to Mett. He has five years, tanking the first one to get some talent and improve this team from a decade of mediocrity to a contender is ok in my book. Do fans really want to continue this barely. 500 shit every year praying to god 4 other teams lose in wk 17 so we can squeak in to the wildcard and get dusted, then draft in the 12-18 range? Lets let Whiz play this out and there's a good possibility were a contender in the afc south EVERY year for the next decade, maybe an afc championship game, maybe a superbowl. Im shooting high, but he's done it before, let's see if he can do it again Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
C_Train Posted October 28, 2014 Report Share Posted October 28, 2014 Again, Whisenhunt is trying to win a Super Bowl, not need 6 different things to happen in week 17 to sneak into the playoffs at 9-7. Im glad somebody else is sick of that same old song and dance too. Wk 5 a good friend mine said something along the lines of "if colts have a few games slump, we split with colts and texans and beat jax twice and finish 9-7 we could get in" I bluntly responded with "fuck that same ol jeff fisher crap, Id rather go 2-14 than THAT" But his mentality just goes to show what most titans fans have accepted as a good season Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Righteous Posted October 28, 2014 Author Report Share Posted October 28, 2014 Plenty of fans hated Whiz before we ever signed him here. Other people have been ripping him for weeks. So no, we didn't hear it here first. But: if this franchise makes the playoffs and Whiz looks better, can we come back and say you were the most irrational poster on the board in regards to Whiz? You know, since you're first and all. Yes...in case you didn't know. I was wrong one time all last year. And it turns out, I was actually right, I just thought I was wrong! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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