Patience and Hope

[Stevenths78]

Just now, Mythos27 said:

There are low-level people with 0 power who do all of those things. Words like "assist" are vague. Vrabel is a former head coach and a proud guy, I don't think they'd want to be like "Oh Mike? Yeah, he sets up the bags for the TE drills and picks them up afterwards". I think you're reading too much into this and at the very least the available evidence doesn't support your conclusions. 

What more evidence do you need? The HC himself said, “He helps me a ton in all Head Coaching Areas”

[Mythos27]

2 minutes ago, Stevenths78 said:

It literally says he is apart of the predeafting process as well and is working with the front office. 

But what part? That's a vague statement. The area scouts are a part of the pre-draft process and they have 0 decision-making power. Vrabel's input probably doesn't even rise to that level. He has no scouting experience. Only a fool would listen to him or be influenced by him. 

[Stevenths78]

Just now, Mythos27 said:

But what part? That's a vague statement. The area scouts are a part of the pre-draft process and they have 0 decision-making power. Vrabel's input probably doesn't even rise to that level. He has no scouting experience. Only a fool would listen to him or be influenced by him. 

You cannot say they are not giving him any decision power when the Browns are telling you otherwise. 
 

The GM literally says in the ESPN article that he helped him with personal decisions 

[Mythos27]

1 minute ago, Stevenths78 said:

What more evidence do you need? The HC himself said, “He helps me a ton in all Head Coaching Areas”

Once again, "helps" is a vague term. If he said something like "Mike designs the weight lifting program" or "Mike designs and runs our conditioning program" or "Mike manages our injury prevention data" then you'd have a point. You're making leaps in logic to arrive at a predetermined idea. It's conspiratorial dot-connecting. 

[Mythos27]

Just now, Stevenths78 said:

You cannot say they are not giving him any decision power when the Browns are telling you otherwise. 
 

The GM literally says in the ESPN article that he helped him with personal decisions 

Did it say that he makes any decisions?

[Stevenths78]

Just now, Mythos27 said:

Did it say that he makes any decisions?

Did it say he didn’t? 

[Mythos27]

Just now, Stevenths78 said:

Did it say he didn’t? 

You don't prove a negative buddy. There are a million things he does not do for them so listing them all would be ridiculous and pointing out that one of those things was not explicitly mentioned as evidence is illogical by definition. Also you're making the affirmative claim that he does so it's on you to provide actual evidence that actually makes those decisions, not for me to disprove. I've actually done too much work already. 

[Stevenths78]

2 minutes ago, Mythos27 said:

You don't prove a negative buddy. There are a million things he does not do for them so listing them all would be ridiculous and pointing out that one of those things was not explicitly mentioned as evidence is illogical by definition. Also you're making the affirmative claim that he does so it's on you to provide actual evidence that actually makes those decisions, not for me to disprove. I've actually done too much work already. 

You haven’t provided anything but your opinion. You also said Vrabel wouldn’t help with scouting when the Browns themselves said he did for this past draft. You said Vrabel doesn’t handle the offense and that’s actually all he has thus far

Edited September 30, 2024 by Stevenths78

[rns90]

1 minute ago, Mythos27 said:

You don't prove a negative buddy. There are a million things he does not do for them so listing them all would be ridiculous and pointing out that one of those things was not explicitly mentioned as evidence is illogical by definition. Also you're making the affirmative claim that he does so it's on you to provide actual evidence that actually makes those decisions, not for me to disprove. I've actually done too much work already. 

There is no evidence that he actually has any juice in the organization.  And why would he? They have an established hierarchy that works there .  Why mess it up just for Vrabel?

[Stevenths78]

1 minute ago, rns90 said:

There is no evidence that he actually has any juice in the organization.  And why would he? They have an established hierarchy that works there .  Why mess it up just for Vrabel?

You’re underestimating Haslem’s stupidity 

Literally Vrabel’s first task was to scout and provide feedback on a set of 2024 prospects. 

https://www.clevelandbrowns.com/news/mike-vrabel-is-returning-to-his-roots-in-unique-role-with-the-browns

[titanruss]

16 minutes ago, Stevenths78 said:

It literally says he is apart of the predeafting process as well and is working with the front office. 

was he even with them pre draft?
 

[Stevenths78]

How bad are the Browns rookies so far asking for a friend,

 

“One of Vrabel's early assignments for the Browns came as Cleveland prepared for the 2024 NFL Draft. Given a list of players, Vrabel compiled his thoughts on potential selections and presented them in pre-draft meetings. As a former player and coach, the Browns valued the input Vrabel had as they drafted their rookie class.”

Edited September 30, 2024 by Stevenths78

[rns90]

3 minutes ago, Stevenths78 said:

You’re underestimating Haslem’s stupidity 

Literally Vrabel’s first task was to scout and provide feedback on a set of 2024 prospects. 

https://www.clevelandbrowns.com/news/mike-vrabel-is-returning-to-his-roots-in-unique-role-with-the-browns

That doesn’t mean he had any role in selecting these guys or that they even valued his thoughts above that of an area scout.

 

There is nothing there that actually says he had influence in any of those decisions.

[oldschool]

1 hour ago, rns90 said:

I almost hate defending the guy .  But it’s gotten way too far in the direction.  The guy is a good coach who probably shouldn’t be coaching a rebuilding team or given personnel powers.

 

What evidence is there he's a good coach? He's not an X's and O's guy. He knows game management but he can't build a coaching staff and he's an asshole no one wants to work with.

Edited September 30, 2024 by oldschool

[rns90]

2 minutes ago, oldschool said:

 

What evidence is there he's a good coach? He's not an X's and O's guy. He knows game management but he can't build a coaching staff and he's an asshole no one wants to work with.

His coaching record?  The 2021 season especially when they had all those injuries in the second half and he won a few games that they weren’t supposed to and got the best record in the AFC.