My thoughts on Syria

[Legaltitan]

(1) I generally like the idea of declaring victory, and bringing our boys home - I'm not worried about letting Russia fill a vacuum there. Let them. Let their soldiers be the ones doing the bleeding for a while. Now that is more complicated with a president that has already been kow towing to Russia, and so I hate the idea of Trump giving them another win. But even with all that, if they want Syria, they can have it.
(2) The way this was done was ridiculous. The use and deployment of troops is a serious matter. I've gotten used to the stupid tweets, but this is not something for Twitter. This is one of those where you have the President, in the oval office, speaking directly to the American people. Explain how our goal was to eradicate the ISIS caliphate, to liberate the cities and people under their oppressive regime, and cripple their military capabilities. Explain that these goals have all been more than accomplished, and that it is now up to the people in that region to continue to fight back against ISIS. It's not that hard.
(3) Many are saying it is stupid to leave now, because ISIS will reform. If that is correct, this is what we mean when we talk about "mission creep." Especially going into the Middle East, the goals always become murky and clouded. Because ultimately, to truly "defeat" ISIS, you need to not only destroy their military, but change the conditions on the ground that led to its formation to begin with. That's a lot. More than we can or should be doing. We have to stop going into places without clearly defined goals and objectives. I heard a military hawk last night say that ISIS isn't defeated yet because ISIS is an "idea," and my blood ran cold. I am tired of fighting ideas. Because fighting ideas has led to perpetual war by us in the Middle East. We are still fighting an idea in Afghanistan almost 20 years later.

[Come on Titans]

 Trump also wants to please Turkey because of his business interests there. Turkey has already threatened to seize Trump Towers in Istanbul.  This also pleases Trump's buddy Putin.......win, win for our Scumbag in Chief

[Mythos27]

1 minute ago, Soxcat said:

Sounds like Trump is turning into Obama to me. 

Middle east policy in both parties has been shit for a long time. Not sure anybody has any answers.

[OILERMAN]

Putin told him to do it

[MadMax]

Just now, OILERMAN said:

Putin told him to do it

So transparent.

[Starkiller]

25 minutes ago, Soxcat said:

Sounds like Trump is turning into Obama to me. 

We should be so lucky!

[MadMax]

10 minutes ago, ben4titans said:

This would be way down Putin's list of things for Trump to do that would benefit Russia in any meaningful way. But hey, facts and logic have never been your strong suit. 

 

Это было бы далеко от путинского списка вещей, которые сделал бы Трамп, что принесет пользу России любым значимым способом. Но эй, факты и логика никогда не были твоей сильной стороной.  Comrade.

[Legaltitan]

1 hour ago, MadMax said:

 

Это было бы далеко от путинского списка вещей, которые сделал бы Трамп, что принесет пользу России любым значимым способом. Но эй, факты и логика никогда не были твоей сильной стороной.  Comrade.

Hey that's pretty good! Google translate, or do you speak Russian?

 

But something's a little off because you are basically saying that Syria is far from being an important thing for Putin, which is basically what ben is saying. That's not what you meant, is it?

 

 Может быть, лучше сказать <<Это главное в списке вещей, которые хочет Путин>> or <<Это главное в списке важных вещей Путина>> 

[MadMax]

2 minutes ago, Legaltitan said:

Hey that's pretty good! Google translate, or do you speak Russian?

Google.  You'll have to talk to ben, and I'm beginning to suspect Rolltard, for someone who actually speaks the Rusky.

[Legaltitan]

2 minutes ago, MadMax said:

Google.  You'll have to talk to ben, and I'm beginning to suspect Rolltard, for someone who actually speaks the Rusky.

See my edit. Something went wrong in the translation and you ended up supporting Ben's position in Russian.

 

[MadMax]

10 minutes ago, Legaltitan said:

See my edit. Something went wrong in the translation and you ended up supporting Ben's position in Russian.

 

I just repeated back to him what he said in his native tongue.  Let him know we can do it too.

[Legaltitan]

4 minutes ago, MadMax said:

I just repeated back to him what he said in his native tongue.  Let him know we can do it too.

Ah, I see.

[9 Nines]

Might be reversed. Fox and Friends criticized the move, so he might flip-flop. 

[begooode]

5 minutes ago, 9 Nines said:

Might be reversed. Fox and Friends criticized the move, so he might flip-flop. 

aka, Trump’s senior advisors

[begooode]

4 hours ago, Legaltitan said:

(1) I generally like the idea of declaring victory, and bringing our boys home - I'm not worried about letting Russia fill a vacuum there. Let them. Let their soldiers be the ones doing the bleeding for a while. Now that is more complicated with a president that has already been kow towing to Russia, and so I hate the idea of Trump giving them another win. But even with all that, if they want Syria, they can have it.
(2) The way this was done was ridiculous. The use and deployment of troops is a serious matter. I've gotten used to the stupid tweets, but this is not something for Twitter. This is one of those where you have the President, in the oval office, speaking directly to the American people. Explain how our goal was to eradicate the ISIS caliphate, to liberate the cities and people under their oppressive regime, and cripple their military capabilities. Explain that these goals have all been more than accomplished, and that it is now up to the people in that region to continue to fight back against ISIS. It's not that hard.
(3) Many are saying it is stupid to leave now, because ISIS will reform. If that is correct, this is what we mean when we talk about "mission creep." Especially going into the Middle East, the goals always become murky and clouded. Because ultimately, to truly "defeat" ISIS, you need to not only destroy their military, but change the conditions on the ground that led to its formation to begin with. That's a lot. More than we can or should be doing. We have to stop going into places without clearly defined goals and objectives. I heard a military hawk last night say that ISIS isn't defeated yet because ISIS is an "idea," and my blood ran cold. I am tired of fighting ideas. Because fighting ideas has led to perpetual war by us in the Middle East. We are still fighting an idea in Afghanistan almost 20 years later.

I think there are other considerations as well. Specifically the level of commitment to the goal, alignment with our allies’ long term objectives, the footprint of US troops (how many, level of engagement), and effectiveness / bang for buck. From what I gather we have fewer troops in Syria than Trump sent to the US border. And this small advisory group has been very effective. With those additional considerations I’m inclined to side with the experts who say now is not the time to leave.