titanruss Posted February 28, 2012 Report Share Posted February 28, 2012 Opinion. I can't think of any RB's in the league really even close to those guys though. Can you? mccoy, CJ, turner, lynch, mcgahee, deangelo williams... two years ago everybody thought forte was crap and he still didn't finish the season or break 1000 and always has a horrible TD/touch ratio... deangelo was the best back in the league 3 years ago while splitting time and still on a per carry basis outperforms almost every back... foster was average at best this year and i'm still convinced he's a system back whose backup has better production when given the chance but that's a different argument... mccoy was possibly the best back in the league this year... lynch just won't go away and had 1200+ and 12 TD's this year... CJ has more total yards and more rushing yards than any back in the league the last 4 years but he doesn't get any consideration?.... even after the holdout, the coaching/team turnover, and the admittedly horrible runblocking he still averaged over 4 ypc and had 1500 total yards. c'mon... if you are going to be short-sighted, at least be consistant. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
scine09 Posted February 28, 2012 Report Share Posted February 28, 2012 Chris Johnson over Forte? Give me a break. The two aren't even in the same galaxy. Forte is better because of his ability to catch the ball out of the backfield. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamalisms Posted February 28, 2012 Report Share Posted February 28, 2012 If you want to big deeper and go top 10, Peterson, Jones-Drew, Rice, Forte, Foster, Gore, Jackson, McCoy, Turner, Lynch in any order you want, how many of those guys were 1st round picks? The answer is very few. Some where taken in the 4th round or later in fact. And of course Foster was undrafted. First of all, 3 of the 10 are first rounders which is still way above the % of RBs taken in that round. Second, all but two are 1st or 2nd round picks. Third, those are still opinion and not production. Fourth, take the next group of guys and they are all 1st rounders. Again, 8 of the top 15 rushers were first rounders and 11 of the top 15 were 1st or 2nd... and that excludes injury prone guys like Peterson and Forte. Drafting RBs early is the surest way to find those who will produce and a simple analysis of those who do produce makes it clear. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
japan Posted February 28, 2012 Report Share Posted February 28, 2012 how did you come up with these so-called top 5 rb's? What's the problem with his list? Who did he leave off? Correction: I see you answered this in a later post. Laughable... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamalisms Posted February 28, 2012 Report Share Posted February 28, 2012 If injuries are a fluke, how about I go back 5 years and look to see what % of 1,000 yard rushers are 1st and 2nd round picks? At what point do actual results overtake opinion? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
scine09 Posted February 28, 2012 Report Share Posted February 28, 2012 The guys who produce are on teams with good run-blocking offensive lines. Ranking RB's to me is silly because in general they are a product of their OL. As far as where the players are drafted, of course in general the higher drafted players will put up more numbers, because they play more. It is very difficult to have an undrafted or late round player beat out an early round player because the early round player is the guy who is supposed to play. Arian Foster probably wouldn't have even started in 2010 if not for Tate's injury. If you look around the league though at when a guy takes over for an injured running back, more times than not the team doesn't miss a beat. Remember this year against the Steelers when Mendenhall went down and the backup killed the TItans in the same way that Mendenhall would have? What about what happened with Dallas when Felix Jones went down? This happens every week in the league. Because the running backs are following the same holes and playing in the same system as the starter was. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
titanruss Posted February 28, 2012 Report Share Posted February 28, 2012 i don't think there is any metric to when RB's should be drafted. still, 1st-3rd rounds are early rounds by any measure at at any position. and unless you have spent a great deal of time on you Oline being the focal point of your offense - If you are always concerned with having the most dominant oline, then you may be able to get away with seeking out only 4th + rounders at the RB position. even then, a 4th rounder may get you 1300 yards while a 1 or 2 gets you 1700 behind a truly dominent o-line... see CJ two years ago. the question is "where is the tipping point?" is that 400+ yards enough to force the defense up and open other areas.? for a team without a dominant QB... most likely. on the other hand, if you have a dominant QB, you don't need the dominant RB. only a guy to keep them honest in between pass attempts. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamalisms Posted February 28, 2012 Report Share Posted February 28, 2012 The guys who produce are on teams with good run-blocking offensive lines. Ranking RB's to me is silly because in general they are a product of their OL. As far as where the players are drafted, of course in general the higher drafted players will put up more numbers, because they play more. It is very difficult to have an undrafted or late round player beat out an early round player because the early round player is the guy who is supposed to play. Arian Foster probably wouldn't have even started in 2010 if not for Tate's injury. True to an extent, yet injuries happen all the time and guys who shine in backup roles get opportunities. Again, how does RB differ from any other position with that complaint? Tom Brady would have never gotten his shot without Bledsoe going down injured. It's a self proving prophecy where you look at what supports your premise and ignore the rest. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
scine09 Posted February 28, 2012 Report Share Posted February 28, 2012 You can't compare the QB position to the RB position. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamalisms Posted February 28, 2012 Report Share Posted February 28, 2012 Because you don't like it? It doesn't fit your paradigm? Exceptions are not the norm, and exist at any position. Look at actual results and there is no debate. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
scine09 Posted February 28, 2012 Report Share Posted February 28, 2012 Because you don't like it? Do you think you can compare the QB position to the RB position? If you do then I don't really know how to respond to that. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamalisms Posted February 28, 2012 Report Share Posted February 28, 2012 In terms of top picks getting the opportunities, your specific example of why highly drafted guys produce at RB, um... hell yes! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
scine09 Posted February 28, 2012 Report Share Posted February 28, 2012 Okay fine. But that doesn't mean that it's just as easy for an undrafted free agent to sign with a team and the next week throw for 300 yards as it is for an undrafted free agent to sign with a team and run for 100 yards, which seems to happen on an almost weekly basis. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
titanruss Posted February 28, 2012 Report Share Posted February 28, 2012 Chris Johnson over Forte? Give me a break. The two aren't even in the same galaxy. Forte is better because of his ability to catch the ball out of the backfield. haha, if that is the case... let's just just put a WR back there instead. no one would argue forte has been more effective in the pass game (but it isn't by much actually and he's also had a much better QB) again.. couldn't be more short-sighted. you are still upset about this years run-game and aren't thinking about other factors. look at forte's stats... please. in the same 4 year period he has .6 less ypc, 13 less TDs, almost 1000 less total yards, almost twice the fumble/touch ratio, 2 more fumbles on less touches, and more than a tenth less yards/touch... in short... he's less effective in nearly every phase of the game when the ball is in his hands. this isn't a CJ discussion... and I know it will go on. But i'm done with it here. The point is, top running backs are drafted high because the team needs them and they do something special. If you do build your team differently, then they may not be as necessary... but not everyone builds their team that way. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
titanruss Posted February 28, 2012 Report Share Posted February 28, 2012 Okay fine. But that doesn't mean that it's just as easy for an undrafted free agent to sign with a team and the next week throw for 300 yards as it is for an undrafted free agent to sign with a team and run for 100 yards, which seems to happen on an almost weekly basis. the titans defense would argue otherwise. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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