gatordude731 Posted March 25, 2015 Report Share Posted March 25, 2015 Protect Mettenberger better. Give him weapons and a defense. If he's not the guy, guess what? Next guy needs all that too. #Titans — Paul Kuharsky (@PaulKuharskyNFL) March 25, 2015 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 25, 2015 Report Share Posted March 25, 2015 The weird thing is, I don't even see a contingent on this site banging the drum and saying Mariota should be the pick. What I've seen was, at the time, a small group of posters who looked at our upcoming draft positioning, the state of the quarterback position, the overall state of the franchise, as well as the profile of Marcus Mariota and said it would be very feasible for the Titans to draft him. Initially, it was laughed off the forum as a non-possibility. People in such stout support of Mettenberger, Leonard Williams, or a combination of both scoffed at this view as being ridiculous. Several weeks later, everyone's gritting their teeth praying that public comments are the exact 180 of the staff's true intentions and getting riled up in anger over something they thought was never going to happen a few short weeks ago. Those of us who said it could happen are now viewed as fanatical fanboys of a quarterback who most have said very little about other than that he's a good prospect and someone the Titans would likely consider. So big, socal, Cyrus, titansfan, and everyone else who's merely defended the notion of *drafting* Mariota, not even necessarily tried to sell the board on him as a player, we're all now going to be viewed with utter disdain if he is the pick and goes on to not have a great NFL career. That's how it goes around here. I saw the truth about the situation right after the Jets game and knew it would very likely go down this route, whether MM ends up being the pick or not, I knew that by April a vast majority of people would flip their stance on it being a real possibility. Now that exactly that has happened, I'm being lumped into some rose-colored glasses homer category when I've made 10x the posts about Mariota potentially being a valid pick versus his actual quality as a football player. I like him, and think he has a chance to succeed, but the narrative for myself and you other folks is that we're 100% all in on him, think he can't fail, think Leonard Williams is a bad prospect, and will be ridiculed if Mariota doesn't pan out. Ah, Titans Report emo much Merc? If we didn't crucify you and Cyrus over Locker we certainly aren't going to do it over Mariota who is obviously a better prospect. Also, the reason everyone is flipping shit over this is because Whisenhunt appears to have a huge crush on Mariota. up until a few weeks ago I didn't think there was a chance in hell Whiz would take this guy and now I'll be shocked if he isn't the pick. You are correct in that a lot of this is simply posters coming to grips with the idea the team is about to reach for its 3rd QB prospect in 10 years. Mariota may turn out to be a good pro but there is no disputing he's a project QB that doesn't fit the current system or it's rigid HC. This has disaster written all over it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
socaltitan Posted March 25, 2015 Author Report Share Posted March 25, 2015 Kuharsky's not a guy I'd look to for football advice Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
KnoxTitan Posted March 25, 2015 Report Share Posted March 25, 2015 Mariota isn't going to crash and burn. He's not going to be a complete bust. He's going to do just well enough to keep getting chance, after chance, after chance because he's the #2 pick in the draft. Unlike the old days it isn't the financial investment that screw you for years it's the fact the QBs picked that high get chance, after, chance, after, chance to prove beyond a doubt that they aren't the guy. All those chances occur over the span of years not games. Mett got six games, that's it, and his chance is done because he's a 6th rounder. The moment we draft Mariota, he is our started and it will take either an injury or incredibly heinous play for him to get another shot and he better be flawless or another rookie QB will be taken. There will be no competition. We pretty much all agree that even if Mett isn't al that he's at least much better than Jake. Well Jake got 4 seasons, Mett got 6 games. If Mariota is just OK, and Mett can't beat him out - then what did we have in Mett anyway? This also assumes that the only thing known by our coaching staff is the 6 games that Mett played in - 6 games where the best we can say is: "He wasn't terrible for a rookie". This might shock some folks, but It's very likely that the coaches know more than we do about Mett's potential, his injury history, his ability to grasp an offense, his long-term development prospects, his work-ethic, etc. All we really know about Mett is that he has a giant arm, and he's better than Jake Locker, and he can't finish a season healthy. I'm of the opinion that you keep swinging on QB's until you hit a homerun, no matter how many times that takes. With the new rookie cap, you can move on from the busts easily, and the fact is - since the NFL turned into Xbox football, no other positions matter very much. Mett or Mariota. I don't care. I want an elite QB. We have a chance to draft a guy who rates higher than most of the QB's who've come out in the past 5 years or so, and probably higher than the guys who will be coming down the pipe for the next 3 years or so. That's hard to turn down. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mercalius Posted March 25, 2015 Report Share Posted March 25, 2015 emo much Merc? If we didn't crucify you and Cyrus over Locker we certainly aren't going to do it over Mariota who is obviously a better prospect. Also, the reason everyone is flipping shit over this is because Whisenhunt appears to have a huge crush on Mariota. up until a few weeks ago I didn't think there was a chance in hell Whiz would take this guy and now I'll be shocked if he isn't the pick. You are correct in that a lot of this is simply posters coming to grips with the idea the team is about to reach for its 3rd QB prospect in 10 years. Mariota may turn out to be a good pro but there is no disputing he's a project QB that doesn't fit the current system or it's rigid HC. This has disaster written all over it. Nah, not emo, but there are a few people who keep namedropping me and paralleling it to the Locker situation, when it's far,far different. I openly admit I looked overlook Locker's flaws and tried to sell him as a franchise QB when he was far from it. That's not the case here. Mariota has some blemishes that worry the shit out of me, but even with those, he's a far superior prospect to Locker. Far better. That doesn't mean I'm sold on him and think that he's the best player we could draft, just that our situation at a base level is one that tends to end in one way most times - the team picks a quarterback early in the draft. Selling that simple notion around here was impossible a few months ago. Now, it's not. People have come around to the idea of it, whether they like Mariota as a player or not, yet somehow with many of them viewing it as a possibility now - I'm getting some roundabout insults and eye-roll type comments going back to Locker when I've literally only said the fans should brace themselves for the very real possibility of Mariota being the pick. He may not be the pick, and if he is the pick, it may be a trainwreck, and I have absolutely 0% to do with either scenario. I just feel like a lot of people are being set up here as fall guys if the second scenario does happen. There's been infinitely more lobbying for the Titans to consider drafting a quarterback than there has been for the Titans to draft Mariota, if that makes sense. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyrus Posted March 25, 2015 Report Share Posted March 25, 2015 For me it really changed when Tony Pauline responded to a tweet of mine regarding Mettenberger's character. He stated that many teams thought he was simply a "bad person". Since then I knew it was a very real possibility that the Titans would be looking to find more stability at the quarterback position and they might always keep an arm's distance from committing to Mettenberger long-term. Then when you consider the injury to Mett it became quite obvious that they wouldn't pass up a guy they felt was a franchise quarterback (with good character). Is Mariota that guy? Not sure. I'm starting to lean towards yes and I think the Titans are too. The more I watched the more my preconceptions of Mariota were changed. I realized I simply hadn't watched enough. In regards to Locker, that was many years ago. Before I watched much of prospects and intently followed the draft. I made excuses for his play (offensive line, wide receiver corps) which were legitimate in a respect, but didn't realize that the traits of overcoming some of those deficiencies were necessary to be an NFL quarterback. Plus he was the complete opposite of Vince Young and checked the boxes off-the-field. Ultimately he wasn't consistent throwing the ball and too often didn't process the field fast enough. He simply couldn't see things happening on an NFL field fast enough and when you go back you can see the same issues in college too. FWIW, Locker and Mariota are not the same prospect at all. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
socaltitan Posted March 25, 2015 Author Report Share Posted March 25, 2015 I'm of the opinion that you keep swinging on QB's until you hit a homerun, no matter how many times that takes. With the new rookie cap, you can move on from the busts easily, and the fact is - since the NFL turned into Xbox football, no other positions matter very much. Mett or Mariota. I don't care. I want an elite QB. We have a chance to draft a guy who rates higher than most of the QB's who've come out in the past 5 years or so, and probably higher than the guys who will be coming down the pipe for the next 3 years or so. That's hard to turn down. The team isn't going to go anywhere until it hits on a franchise QB. It's not a coincidence that the good teams have good QB and the bad ones don't. The last time this team was really good was when it had a franchise QB. No coincidence there. Both Mariota and Winston have warts, but name a QB other than Luck in recent memory that didn't. I agree, I feel both guys measure up pretty well with the QB who've come out in recent years. Not on Luck's level as a prospect. Maybe not on Stafford's. But I'd say right below that which is still pretty good. I feel about the same about these guys as I did on Bradford and Ryan at the time which isn't bad. Bradford hasn't quite panned out, but both were pretty good prospects. People forget Ryan had a lot of detractors as well. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
big2033 Posted March 25, 2015 Report Share Posted March 25, 2015 For me it really changed when Tony Pauline responded to a tweet of mine regarding Mettenberger's character. He stated that many teams thought he was simply a "bad person". Since then I knew it was a very real possibility that the Titans would be looking to find more stability at the quarterback position and they might always keep an arm's distance from committing to Mettenberger long-term. Then when you consider the injury to Mett it became quite obvious that they wouldn't pass up a guy they felt was a franchise quarterback (with good character). Is Mariota that guy? Not sure. I'm starting to lean towards yes and I think the Titans are too. The more I watched the more my preconceptions of Mariota were changed. I realized I simply hadn't watched enough. Honestly us drafting Mariota may have come down to Mett not finishing the season. Who knows if he might've turned it around. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 25, 2015 Report Share Posted March 25, 2015 The team isn't going to go anywhere until it hits on a franchise QB. It's not a coincidence that the good teams have good QB and the bad ones don't. The last time this team was really good was when it had a franchise QB. No coincidence there. Both Mariota and Winston have warts, but name a QB other than Luck in recent memory that didn't. I agree, I feel both guys measure up pretty well with the QB who've come out in recent years. Not on Luck's level as a prospect. Maybe not on Stafford's. But I'd say right below that which is still pretty good. I feel the same about these guys as I did on Bradford and Ryan which isn't bad. Bradford hasn't quite panned out, but both were pretty good prospects. People forget Ryan had a lot of detractors as well. you keep regurgitating this point and it's a poor one. We all agree fiding a QB is the most important thing for a franchise. That doesn't mean you keep reaching for them over and over until you get lucky and hit on one. The 2010 draft with Locker, Gabbert, and Ponder is proof of that. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
socaltitan Posted March 25, 2015 Author Report Share Posted March 25, 2015 Honestly us drafting Mariota may have come down to Mett not finishing the season. Who knows if he might've turned it around. I remember PK had a blog entry where he asked a bunch of other personnel people around the league about Mett and the large majority said they were not sold on the guy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyrus Posted March 25, 2015 Report Share Posted March 25, 2015 Remind me what year it was when he met FSU in the Rose Bowl or OSU in the National Championship? It escapes me. I don't think Mariota played particularly poorly in either game. I thought he played well against FSU. They were in position a few times to make it close in the second half, but it never materialized. That includes two horrible, horrible drops - which I don't use to defend Mariota, but point out they made a difference in the outcome of the game. But you have to watch more than just two games from 2014. There are seven up on draft breakdown now. Ah, no. Not really anything similar there in any way. In fact, when you go back through Mett's college games you'll see a lot of his guys dropping passes that hit them squarely in the hands. Not because he threw it too hard, simply because they either looked away from the ball or heard the footsteps of defenders. There's no comparison at all between Mettenberger and Mariota passing the football. That is a complete landslide victory in Mettenberger's favor. There's nothing in pretty much any way that is similar about Mettenberger and Mariota, right down to self confidence. Everything about Mariota mechanically is faster. I'd also argue that he processes things faster too on the field or at least moves from 1-2 much quicker. He also throws better to the middle of the field than Mettenberger. Mettenberger is a better perimeter thrower for sure and his arm strength is superior as well. You could easily argue that Mariota is a better decision maker as well. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mercalius Posted March 25, 2015 Report Share Posted March 25, 2015 you keep regurgitating this point and it's a poor one. We all agree fiding a QB is the most important thing for a franchise. That doesn't mean you keep reaching for them over and over until you get lucky and hit on one. The 2010 draft with Locker, Gabbert, and Ponder is proof of that. I think this is the biggest disconnect a lot of folks have. They simply don't like Mariota as a prospect, or they think, even as a decent prospect, picking him 2nd overall is a bit too early. That's a perfectly acceptable view to have and not something I'm even going to argue. Our track record has been pretty bad at drafting quarterbacks for over a decade. And Mariota definitely has some flaws. That being said, it's looking more and more like Whisenhunt and company aren't viewing him as a reach. Folks can stick to their guns and think he is, or they can buy in to what the staff is selling. I haven't fully bought in, but it does make me feel better moving forward, if he is the pick, that Whisenhunt seems blown away by him, rather than merely seeming content. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 25, 2015 Report Share Posted March 25, 2015 Nah, not emo, but there are a few people who keep namedropping me and paralleling it to the Locker situation, when it's far,far different. I openly admit I looked overlook Locker's flaws and tried to sell him as a franchise QB when he was far from it. That's not the case here. Mariota has some blemishes that worry the shit out of me, but even with those, he's a far superior prospect to Locker. Far better. That doesn't mean I'm sold on him and think that he's the best player we could draft, just that our situation at a base level is one that tends to end in one way most times - the team picks a quarterback early in the draft. Selling that simple notion around here was impossible a few months ago. Now, it's not. People have come around to the idea of it, whether they like Mariota as a player or not, yet somehow with many of them viewing it as a possibility now - I'm getting some roundabout insults and eye-roll type comments going back to Locker when I've literally only said the fans should brace themselves for the very real possibility of Mariota being the pick. He may not be the pick, and if he is the pick, it may be a trainwreck, and I have absolutely 0% to do with either scenario. I just feel like a lot of people are being set up here as fall guys if the second scenario does happen. There's been infinitely more lobbying for the Titans to consider drafting a quarterback than there has been for the Titans to draft Mariota, if that makes sense. Merc, I brought up the parallel between your pre-draft comments on Locker and the ones you've been making lately about Mariota not to discredit you but to show that even respected posters get caught up in glossing over a prospect's flaws because they either a.) want that guy drafted or b.) have resigned themselves to the fact the team is drafting said player. All of us get shit wrong from time to time. Hell I thought Leaf would be a better pro then Manning. How did that turn out for me? lol. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
big2033 Posted March 25, 2015 Report Share Posted March 25, 2015 Remind me what year it was when he met FSU in the Rose Bowl or OSU in the National Championship? It escapes me. So you're going to focus on two games in 2014 and now go backwards to 2013 to a time before he improved on accuracy, footwork and the playbook? Makes sense. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
KnoxTitan Posted March 25, 2015 Report Share Posted March 25, 2015 you keep regurgitating this point and it's a poor one. We all agree fiding a QB is the most important thing for a franchise. That doesn't mean you keep reaching for them over and over until you get lucky and hit on one. The 2010 draft with Locker, Gabbert, and Ponder is proof of that. How else are going to find one if you don't keep trying? VY and Locker busted, so we should never take another QB before the 6th round? Who cares where the guy is drafted, or if it's a reach. If the guy is a quality prospect who projects to be a quality NFL player, then you have to take them, often high. And even is Mariota is a "reach", what's his actual draft value - it's probably not much lower than 10-15. Turn back the clock to 2010, and Andy Dalton is a reach at #8. Yet, we'd be in good shape had we "reached" for him at 8. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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