Chris Johnson was REALLY BAD last year

[Guest]

This has been brought up before. Backs, especially small backs, need momentum to break tackles and gain yards after contact.. You don't have momentum when you're caught in the backfield. CJ had his issues but this is hardly a beat all, end all stat.

 

Moving on.

 

I knew Reo wouldn't let us down, lol.

[Jamalisms]

False.

 

Foster had 391 touches last year (regular season), which is significantly more than the 331 from 2011, (60 touches, 18% and equatable to three extra 2011 games), and crosses or approaches a very dangerous threshhold for RB touches in a single year. Beyond that, a higher percent of his touches were on runs which, imo, are generally more wearing-type touches.... and in four of his last five regular season games he didn't get more than 16 rushes (they lost 3 of those games) which brought the total down and really magnifies just how much he was severely overused early in the season... and, imo again, getting so overused in a smaller window of time is harder to recover from than even usage throughout the year.

 

... he also had 10 more post season touches last year than in 2011... a total of 460 touches in 2012.

[TheChosenTitan]

Cj best back in league

[Guest]

Cj best back in league

 

There isn't any scenario where CJ is better than AP. 

[WG53]

False.

Foster had 391 touches last year (regular season), which is significantly more than the 331 from 2011, (60 touches, 18% and equatable to three extra 2011 games), and crosses or approaches a very dangerous threshhold for RB touches in a single year. Beyond that, a higher percent of his touches were on runs which, imo, are generally more wearing-type touches.... and in four of his last five regular season games he didn't get more than 16 rushes (they lost 3 of those games) which brought the total down and really magnifies just how much he was severely overused early in the season... and, imo again, getting so overused in a smaller window of time is harder to recover from than even usage throughout the year.

... he also had 10 more post season touches last year... a total of 460 touches in 2012.

Try again douchebag.

I said 2010. He had 393 touches in 2010.

[Jamalisms]

Ah, 2010 more similar, minus the two post-season games that bumped the total way up and I think 2010 was spread out more between 1st half and 2nd half... and a lower % on runs in 2010.

 

He also hasn't been the same back since 2010... and worse in 2012 than 2011... which, if you bothered to pay attention and think a bit, only serves to support the point of saying usage has had an effect on him.  So, really, you support the point you disagree with. Status quo for you.

[WG53]

Ah, 2010 more similar, minus the two post-season games that bumped the total way up and I think 2010 was spread out more between 1st half and 2nd half... and a lower % on runs in 2010.

He also hasn't been the same back since 2010... and worse in 2012 than 2011... which, if you bothered to pay attention and think a bit, only serves to support the point of saying usage has had an effect on him. So, really, you support the point you disagree with. Status quo for you.

Keep backtracking.

[Starkiller]

There isn't any scenario where CJ is better than AP. 

Unless it is cheetah related...

[Starkiller]

As far as CJ and breaking tackles, there a big difference in breaking open field tackles vs breaking tackles near the line of scrimmage. The last few years he has been bottled up near the line. Where he is most dangerous is the open field and that's why he had more success in the past.

[Guest]

As far as CJ and breaking tackles, there a big difference in breaking open field tackles vs breaking tackles near the line of scrimmage. The last few years he has been bottled up near the line. Where he is most dangerous is the open field and that's why he had more success in the past.

 

This is simply not true. He was taken down in the open field without much effort numerous times over the past two years.

[TheChosenTitan]

There were no holes for CJ at all

[Jamalisms]

I've continued to hold out the original point as true and comparing 2012 to 2010 instead of 2011 is simply addressing what you said after I had originally not realized what year you mentioned. That's the opposite of backpedaling, moron.

I'll break it down for you since you lack the ability to think before piss-contest posting.

I still think (still my opinion like the original post you disagreed with) that Foster's over-usage affected him last year. Before the last five games he was on an absolutely absurd pace for touches and they finally backed off... which lost them games and explains some of why they did it in the first place but fails to really compensate for the pounding he took early on since the body simply doesn't recover that way. By the end of the year he had touch totals that approach or exceed a general rule for "too many" when reviewing prior RB performances.

You referenced 2010 as a year with similar touches. It's actually about 60 fewer touches in 2010 than 2012 once post season is included, (60 fewer is much like 2011 actually), which is still not really similar but you seem to think the regular season is the only time a player's touches wear on him.

Granted they had similar touches over a 16 game regular season but that's only so relevant to my post about his year as a whole. Nonetheless, I considered your point at face value instead of belaboring the fact that 60 touches in the postseason is still 60 extra touches and provided a reason that this only further shows how over-use is affecting him. To wit, Foster hasn't looked the same or reached the same production since he was last used so heavily. It wears on a player and his rushing average has only fallen since 2010, which supports this. Add in the over-use of 2012 (front loaded, no less) on top of the over-use that already affected him and I feel quite comfortable disagreeing with you and maintaining the original position that he was sorely tried by 2012 and it affected his results.

This is why you are hidden and I shouldn't have even bothered responding when someone quoted you.

[scine09]

There isn't any scenario where CJ is better than AP. 

Or Lynch or Gore or Rice or Foster or Jones-Drew or Charles or Mccoy or Forte or Martin.

[titanruss]

Probably the best comment made about CJ on any board, and I wish I remembered who made it, was CJ may be the worst RB in football with bad blocking but the best with good blocking. 

 

CJ does occasionally break a tackle or cut back when the original hole is stuffed but for the most part he isn't one of those guys who is going to pull off a run filled with broken tackles or jukes. He is basically a one cut and go guy and nobody is better when he has a lane.  But CJ is bad if he has to avoid tacklers in his path.  No RB is going to be very effective getting hit in the back field. 

 

Which is exactly why they signed Greene.  If CJ isn't getting it done they have a guy who can get tough yardage. 

 

Pretty sure that was me. A play that will net 10 yards for the average RB gets CJ 20 but a play that gets 2 for the average RB gets CJ 1 or zero. Plays in the backfield are pretty much always the lines fault and not much can be done on the RB's part there. CJ has never been great at downfield juking, if he has to think about it then he's probably going to get tackled.That's one of the reasons for his regression... he is over-thinking about where he needs to go because of the shitty blocking. I think we'll see marked improvement in the interior run game this year but possibly a slight falloff in the stretch as stewart will be a little worse. 

 

as for the rest....CJ was more effective on a per carry basis when there was a change of pace guy to pair him with. One of the reasons i've been on board with rushing lendale/keeping blount/and asking to bring greene in before we even thought about signing him. 

 

The threat of CJ breaking a long run is still large enough (despite his lower consistency) that defenses respect it very much. We should really be employing the play fake much more frequently than we did last year to help our young QB.

[titanruss]

I remember it was either in '08 or his mega-year in '09 that he led the league in broken tackles...even over Peterson.(!) Not sure what happened after that, but he is definitely a different player since then.

 

There's another back that everyone goes crazy over that can't break a tackle, and he's not even a smaller back, and that's Arian Foster. I swear to GOD he has to be worse than CJ after contact. They both seem to lay down on purpose half the time. But if they do get through the hole without contact....totally different story.

 

Foster is way over-rated as a runner and is a product of the system. He gets what is given and nothing more. He is consistent at that though.