Grantland: The Miami Dolphins and Everything That Will Never Make Sense

[IsntLifeFunny]

Ok, only problem is this wasn't ribbing. This was harassment and or abuse. So this is like a boss sexually harassing a new intern to this extant.

That's my problem with everyone defending the guy is that they continue to act like this guy was defenseless. The guy is massive and is easily capable of defending himself.

[Stan]

That's my problem with everyone defending the guy is that they continue to act like this guy was defenseless. The guy is massive and is easily capable of defending himself.

That makes no difference how big or small a guy is. We don't know Martin's mental capacity. We can't say how he works just because on the outside he might seem like a hard shell, but it's what's between the ears that matters. It seems Martin has his issues that these guys took advantage of and nobody on that team stood up to stop it.

[Bobo]

Kidding? No. Have you read how most people are quock to defend Incognito or say Martin should have gotten into a fight?

Most are absolutely blaming Martin

Just as quick as those jumping to condemn Incognito? Still your point about America and victims is so far off reality.

[Stan]

This is like blaming the rape victim because she had it "coming" for wearing a shorter skirt or dress.

[IsntLifeFunny]

That makes no difference how big or small a guy is. We don't know Martin's mental capacity. We can't say how he works just because on the outside he might seem like a hard shell, but it's what's between the ears that matters. It seems Martin has his issues that these guys took advantage of and nobody on that team stood up to stop it.

While I agree with the sentiment, I'm not talking about that. I'm talking about people acting like this is similar to a rape or sexual harassment case, when it is nothing even close to similar.

[WG53]

This is like blaming the rape victim because she had it "coming" for wearing a shorter skirt or dress.

This is exactly my point.

[WG53]

Just as quick as those jumping to condemn Incognito? Still your point about America and victims is so far off reality.

My point is spot on.

And Incognito's history is a huge factor in people condemning him.

[WG53]

Okay. Would you have thought it was childish to knock the guy out if he actually threatened him and his family?

I think threatening family is separate from hazing.

But I see your point.

Would just like to add that I've repeatedly said Incognito was out of line. I personally lay the majority of the blame on the Dolphins coaches and FO for not dealing with this properly. However, I do blame Martin for not taking other avenues (that I know of, so I could be completely wrong) including defending himself if need be.

This is the NFL, and hazing happens all the time. Look what happened to Prince Amakamura in NY as an example. They literally dumped the guy in an ice tub and were talking a lot of shit. It doesn't make it right. It's just the reality of the sport we all love.

I said nothing about whether you support him or condemn him or are apathic towards Richie. My comments were generally aimed at other posters.

I played football myself. I know how the locker room dynamics work. Usually it is one guy being an asshole at first then others joining in like cowards.

Just because instances of this happen does not make it acceptable. Martin did what any rational adult should have done and removed himself from the environment and that does not make him weak or soft or a lesser man. All this "he should have kicked his ass" nonsense is ridiculous machismo bravado. Knowing when to walk away is not a negative trait.

[IsntLifeFunny]

I think threatening family is separate from hazing.

But I see your point.

I said nothing about whether you support him or condemn him or are apathic towards Richie. My comments were generally aimed at other posters.

I played football myself. I know how the locker room dynamics work. Usually it is one guy being an asshole at first then others joining in like cowards.

Just because instances of this happen does not make it acceptable. Martin did what any rational adult should have done and removed himself from the environment and that does not make him weak or soft or a lesser man. All this "he should have kicked his ass" nonsense is ridiculous machismo bravado. Knowing when to walk away is not a negative trait.

Well said.

 

I agree to a large extent. However, it's possible that everyone was involved, including Martin, and then he just snapped. If in reality Martin was egging this on himself, then he's just as wrong as the others. It's definitely possible that he tried to join in, ribbed other people, backed out somewhat, the coaches put Incognito on him, he rejoined the fray, and then he snapped. I actually think it's probably what happened seeing as others said he played the same stand up from the table prank on others (from what I've read).

 

Football is very similar to a fraternity. The hazing involved sometimes steps over the line and things need to be dealt with accordingly. My issue is that people keep saying the guy is a victim without actually knowing the situation. If he was laughing and showing off the VM in April, while still pranking other players, then doesn't that show he involved himself in the situation? If he truly felt threatened, then why didn't this come out in April? I don't know those answers, but they definitely leave the ordeal open to interpretation. Maybe he was just trying to fit in, but it leaves him liable in my eyes for at least some of it, and I can understand everyone involved feeling betrayed.

[WG53]

It is a tricky situation. My problem with it is listening to what other Dolphins say about it. There is a tendency to lie or distort the truth to protect friends. I think this may be the case here. If it is not the case and Martin is overplaying or lying then he will have to deal with the reprecussions and deservedly so.

I admit I may be too quick to judge but so are many others. But I do think calling someone soft because they walked away from a situation like this and did not handle it the way they think a 300+ lb man should is silly bravado and machismo ran wild.

Any sane person would have to admit this type of behavior is not out of the realm of possibility with Incognito given his past.

[IsntLifeFunny]

Yep. I immediately sided with Martin when this first came out because of Incognito's history. But, after hearing the Murtha story and a few others made me reconsider. If he was laughing and joking about the VM, then he obviously, at least in my mind, didn't feel threatened. That would be a very unordinary reaction to actually feeling threatened, even in that situation. It's the fact that he was in on pranks, laughed about the VM, and waited months after the most incriminating evidence to remove himself that makes the whole situation tough to read.

[WG53]

I think you have to take what Murtha says with a grain of salt. His credibility is lacking when you consider he was not there for the vast majority of time we are talking about.

[IsntLifeFunny]

Meh. He was there when the guy was drafted and probably saw the a good bit of the situation unfold. Just because he wasn't there for the end result doesn't mean he doesn't have any insight into the situation. Of course I'm taking the whole damn thing with a grain of salt. People will back their friends, and the guy feeling slighted will exaggerate his claims. That's the way of the world, I guess it's how it goes.

[OILERMAN]

Oman vs Incognito in a fight.  Who wins?

 

I think a lot of people would like to see that one, not to see who would win

 

[OILERMAN]

Titans Report

 

I responded before I finished the thread!