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Raiders close to signing Mariota

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19 minutes ago, big2033 said:

He wasn't playing great or good by any means. But you had to wait until he was racking up turnovers and completely imploded. That's the only way to leave no doubt to the uninformed fans and owner.  Or, you'd have a fanbase wondering if you would've won more games with wonderboy even if Tannehill went 13-3.

 

This is how it works with QBs drafted high. You hold on for dear life until the rope snaps.

 

You don't make decisions based on what fans think.  Especially this fan base.....

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23 minutes ago, Soxcat said:

 

@BudAdams More BS from the idiot.  Maybe we could agree Tannehill should have been in there sooner but Mariota was going to start game one.... period.  TC doesn't mean crap.  Mariota was a 5th year QB making $20 mil and it was his job to lose.  Also, Mariota had a 133 QB rating in our first game.  93.5 the second and 81.7 the 3rd (Jags) but bounced back with a 130 in the 4th game.  No he didn't play great but this idea they should have pulled him based on his play has no merit.  Remember they didn't know Tannehill would look so good.  You don't play musical chairs with the QB in the NFL.  Soon as he imploded against Denver they made a change.  

 

You seriously are going to Passer Rating to defend MM in weeks 2 and 3 when he was HORRIBLE???  Even the Cleveland game was where the team threw something like 5 passes in the 2nd half and 3 were easy TD's (one thanks to Henry's YAC and the two gimmees to Walker.....LOL.

 

I agree that Mariota played because he was making 20 M and IMO that should have enabled him to go into TC as the starter.  Of course, that's where it should have ended.  The team was good everywhere but at QB.  Anyone watching Tannehill and Mariota in preseason could see the gap.  In fact, the first preseason game started the national chatter because MM looked so bad and Tannehill so good.  That's also when the reports came out about the coaches wanting to play the best guy (how coincidental)........  If they would have had an open competition, Tannehill undoubtedly would have won. 

 

The same gap continued in the regular season.  Mariota legitimately had two good halves in the six games and even in those quarters, the play design enabled wide open easy throws that pumped up those Passer Ratings.......In the other 18 halves or so, Mariota was the same guy we saw for years.  The film didn't lie - open plays left on the field and the successful ones were schemed, horrid point production, etc. 

 

Tannehill exceeding expectations had nothing to do with being better than Mariota.  He always was better and there's plenty of evidence that the coaches knew it.  Mariota played based on BS pedigree/salary.

 

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1 minute ago, BudAdams said:

 

You seriously are going to Passer Rating to defend MM in weeks 2 and 3 when he was HORRIBLE???  Even the Cleveland game was where the team threw something like 5 passes in the 2nd half and 3 were easy TD's (one thanks to Henry's YAC and the two gimmees to Walker.....LOL.

It's like he never watched the games.  That Jacksonville game was the pits and is an example of why you shouldn't always trust passer rating.

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Just now, rns90 said:

It's like he never watched the games.  That Jacksonville game was the pits and is an example of why you shouldn't always trust passer rating.

 

He had something like a 65 rating versus Cleveland until the 4th quarter when they scored on the 75 yard screen pass that went two yards in the air and the two short passes to Walker after Baker started turning the ball over.....

 

Not to mention Mariota is the poster child for things like PFF Rating and QBR based on all of the unnecessary sacks or non effective scrambles on plays where he won't throw the damn ball to an NFL open receiver or a second read.

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2 minutes ago, BudAdams said:

Not to mention Mariota is the poster child for things like PFF Rating and QBR based on all of the unnecessary sacks or non effective scrambles on plays where he won't throw the damn ball to an NFL open receiver or a second read.

Which is why it's laughable that some here (and elsewhere) believe he'll somehow become better in OAK.  You can't fix those flaws that he has.

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Aside from the terminology he'll have to learn, the hard coaching from Gruden doesn't seem to mesh with Beta Boy.  I imagine he's never been yelled at by a coach. 

 

 

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9 minutes ago, BudAdams said:

 

He had something like a 65 rating versus Cleveland until the 4th quarter when they scored on the 75 yard screen pass that went two yards in the air and the two short passes to Walker after Baker started turning the ball over.....

 

Not to mention Mariota is the poster child for things like PFF Rating and QBR based on all of the unnecessary sacks or non effective scrambles on plays where he won't throw the damn ball to an NFL open receiver or a second read.

Mariota has always scored reasonably well per PFF , and QBR as well prior to this year.  At least compared to the perception that several of us had of him.  In no way was Tannehill superior to him in any measure.  Even if he did look better in practice, that hadn't translated to games or to the win column so there was nothing to sell the QB change to anyone.  Using preseason as evidence sure as hell wouldn't justify the change.

Edited by abc2330

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6 minutes ago, abc2330 said:

Mariota has always scored reasonably well per PFF , and QBR as well prior to this year.  At least compared to the perception that several of us had of him.  In no way was Tannehill superior to him in any measure.  Even if he did look better in practice, that hadn't translated to games or to the win column so there was nothing to sell the QB change to anyone.  Using preseason as evidence sure as hell wouldn't justify the change.

I was a big mariota defender over the years but by week 5 it was so obvious that he had lost all confidence that it was insane to trot him out there. The guy was so shell shocked he wore his helmet on the sidelines like he was still worried about being hit.

Edited by Callidus

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1 minute ago, abc2330 said:

Mariota has always scored reasonably well per PFF , and QBR as well prior to this year.  In no way was Tannehill superior to him in any measure.  Even if he did look better in practice, that hadn't translated to games or to the win column so there was nothing to sell the QB change to anyone.  Using preseason as evidence sure as hell wouldn't justify the change.

 

Anyone who watched the game film and those outside of Nashville knew Mariota was the problem.  The Sando poll sure knew.  Sounds like the coaches knew too.

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1 hour ago, BudAdams said:

 

You don't make decisions based on what fans think.  Especially this fan base.....

 

I'm going to give you a dose of reality here ... your logic does not matter.

 

It's the way it is. Not just for our franchise but for every franchise.

 

Unless the highly drafted QB pulls a Manziel ... they're going to give him a long rope till it breaks.

 

Accept the reality. It'll happen again and again and again and again. 

 

This is why it's imperative you pick right. You're not drafting a position, you're drafting a face. And barring an absolute trainwreck they'll be given at least the entirety of their contract.

Edited by big2033

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5 minutes ago, big2033 said:

 

I'm going to give you a dose of reality here ... your logic does not matter.

 

It's the way it is. Not just for our franchise but for every franchise.

 

Unless the highly drafted QB pulls a Manziel ... they're going to give him a long rope till it breaks.

 

Accept the reality. It'll happen again and again and again and again. 

Yup.  Happened with Young and Locker beforehand, and especially when Mariota had "successes" in the past (which turned out to be a mirage).  The idiots...err paying public are going to wonder why you're not giving him a chance.  He was also a big part of their PR campaign.  I hate that those type of things matter but the Titans are a business as well.

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7 minutes ago, rns90 said:

Yup.  Happened with Young and Locker beforehand, and especially when Mariota had "successes" in the past (which turned out to be a mirage).  The idiots...err paying public are going to wonder why you're not giving him a chance.  He was also a big part of their PR campaign.  I hate that those type of things matter but the Titans are a business as well.

 

The Bears are still starting Mitchell Trubisky and we're going into year four and they've finally brought in competition ... Nick Foles. Not exactly a big replacement.

 

They're going to keep giving him every chance to hold on. And in terms of promising moments he's had a much worse career than Mariota.

Edited by big2033

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16 minutes ago, big2033 said:

 

I'm going to give you a dose of reality here ... your logic does not matter.

 

It's the way it is. Not just for our franchise but for every franchise.

 

Unless the highly drafted QB pulls a Manziel ... they're going to give him a long rope till it breaks.

 

Accept the reality. It'll happen again and again and again and again. 

 

This is why it's imperative you pick right. You're not drafting a position, you're drafting a face. And barring an absolute trainwreck they'll be given at least the entirety of their contract.

 

I do get that although I disagree on the fan front as they are largely irrelevant and in most cases flat out ignorant.   You are giving fans way too much credit for influence.  Ownership, however, is a totally different story and it's where the economics are a real factor.  Plus the FO is also invested on justifying their past decisions.  If I'm paying Mariota $ 21 M and Tannehill $ 2 M, it's not a good optic or highlight on a resume if you immediately determine the vastly cheaper player is the starter.  Easing into it is more palatable for the FO.  Typically, this is where the FO and the coaches tend to split as the coaches simply are worried about winning in the present. 

 

The reality, however, is that both Mariota and Winston were the first two QB's to actually play on the 5th year option.  Every other high pick QB was either extended or had the 5th year option declined.  It was revolutionary territory on how long a team needs to figure out the player.  In both cases, the team probably knew the answer but fought it and one year later both guys will be backups on another team.

 

 

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