Popular Post BudsOilers Posted November 14, 2019 Popular Post Report Share Posted November 14, 2019 6 minutes ago, Starkiller said: Fisher Fired Steckel because he interviewed for another job (and not even a promotion), not for his performance. With TB and Dungy. Best thing that ever happened as it opened the door for Heimerdinger. SuperFreak90, Ricky, DCTitan, and 2 others 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TerryBoats Posted November 14, 2019 Report Share Posted November 14, 2019 32 minutes ago, tgo said: Smith has not been "so bad." He's had a few questionable moments/games. But he has done very well for a rookie OC and he and Vrabel work well together. He could prove to be not the answer depending on what happens over the next 6 games, but his offense is 7th in DVOA and a top scoring offense since Tannehill took over. His offense has elevated Tannehill's game as well so far. This idea that he's garbage is just divorced from reality at this point. I think what has elevated Tannehill's game is the competition and for the potential $$$ (the effect they hoped it would have on Mariota) and the team being better than what he's experienced before. The sample size is large enough to see that he's a good and very efficient game manager and that his bad games really only occur when the team stinks and they take him down with him, like against Carolina. When he's afforded good protection and the game is within reach, He plays really well and that was my entire argument for starting him from the beginning. The strange thing is that when Marita was QB, receivers seemed to be open nearly every play. Now with Tannehill, we're rarely seeing open windows. Either Marita forced him into a shell, or his plays were really easy to scheme against once we had a QB to respect Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Puck Posted November 14, 2019 Report Share Posted November 14, 2019 23 minutes ago, Starkiller said: Fisher Fired Steckel because he interviewed for another job (and not even a promotion), not for his performance. i didn't say why he was fired fwiw. meanwhile, Steckel was not a good coordinator. if he was worth keeping around, looking around at other opportunities wouldn't have been the only grounds. that was just broke the camel's back. he wasn't very good to begin with, and going around trying to leave just inspired the org to let him leave - by force or not. if he would've been a guy like a Shanahan or a McVay, he probably would have received a better offer to remain. lost in all this was a challenge to the concept that Arthur Smith isn't capable of leading a team to a Super Bowl. whereas my premise is that it doesn't take a great OC to achieve such a thing. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cajuntitan Posted November 14, 2019 Report Share Posted November 14, 2019 I’d extend Tannehill for 4-5 yrs. I’d also keep the OC. It would be nice to have some consistency at both positions for a change. SuperFreak90, and tgo 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
tgo Posted November 14, 2019 Report Share Posted November 14, 2019 1 minute ago, Cajuntitan said: I’d extend Tannehill for 4-5 yrs. I’d also keep the OC. It would be nice to have some consistency at both positions for a change. Would be good to start all 5 OL again for for once next year too and let some chemistry build there. You just cannot sustain success without consistency. japan 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TerryBoats Posted November 14, 2019 Report Share Posted November 14, 2019 (edited) Consistency is only good if the coach is. If we continue to kill drives with penalties, can't protect the QB with an expensive line, can't get the expensive skill players involved, can't keep the offense on the field due to a high rate failed third downs, I'm not sure why anyone would want anything to do with him beyond this year. Maybe we're just used to watching bad offense. Edited November 14, 2019 by abc2330 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BudsOilers Posted November 14, 2019 Report Share Posted November 14, 2019 Coaching doesn't make Lewan have unnecessary holding penalties, false starts, or asinine personal foul penalties after the play. Mythos27 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
tgo Posted November 14, 2019 Report Share Posted November 14, 2019 (edited) 19 minutes ago, abc2330 said: Consistency is only good if the coach is. If we continue to kill drives with penalties, can't protect the QB with an expensive line, can't get the expensive skill players involved, can't keep the offense on the field due to a high rate failed third downs, I'm not sure why anyone would want anything to do with him beyond this year. Maybe we're just used to watching bad offense. Arthur Smith isn't the one coaching the OL on the field and coaching in the OL meetings - the OL coach is. So you could either replace the OL coach, or if we get to the end of the year and are really happy with the run game and the OL are performing well in that arena but not pass pro, then you could bring in someone who is keen on zone pass protection to be the assistant OL coach. Someone who has experience working with Carter like Chris Morgan or a history with Arthur Smith like Hal Hunter who is better on the pass protection side. Or if they want to keep Carter and Sullivan both, then bring in an OL guy who also has coordinating experience to help out - like Philbin or Callahan or whoever to be a senior offensive assistant. And in terms of getting skill players involved - I don't understand this obsession with style points. The goal is to have an effective offense that scores more points than the other team. Who cares about which players are scoring the points or "getting involved" as long as the offense is effective and the team is winning. Edited November 14, 2019 by tgo oldschool 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TerryBoats Posted November 14, 2019 Report Share Posted November 14, 2019 13 minutes ago, tgo said: Arthur Smith isn't the one coaching the OL on the field and coaching in the OL meetings - the OL coach is. So you could either replace the OL coach, or if we get to the end of the year and are really happy with the run game and the OL are performing well in that arena but not pass pro, then you could bring in someone who is keen on zone pass protection to be the assistant OL coach. Someone who has experience working with Carter like Chris Morgan or a history with Arthur Smith like Hal Hunter who is better on the pass protection side. Or if they want to keep Carter and Sullivan both, then bring in an OL guy who also has coordinating experience to help out - like Philbin or Callahan or whoever. And in terms of getting skill players involved - I don't understand this obsession with style points. The goal is to have an effective offense that scores more points than the other team. Who cares about which players are scoring the points or "getting involved" as long as the offense is effective. We had the same OL coach a year ago and didn't have nearly as many QB hits or penalties. As far as the skill players are concerned, we have guys who can help us win and they aren't getting the ball. Humphries and Davis were two of the better chain movers a year ago, and they can hardly get their hands on the ball when our main issue is moving the chains. And getting other guys involved would benefit the only thing that we are doing consistently, which is handing the ball to the RB. There just seems to be a lot of untapped potential for an offense which is so effective when it needs to score (red zone and end of game scenarios) yet drags its ass most of the rest of the time Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
tgo Posted November 14, 2019 Report Share Posted November 14, 2019 8 minutes ago, abc2330 said: We had the same OL coach a year ago and didn't have nearly as many QB hits or penalties. As far as the skill players are concerned, we have guys who can help us win and they aren't getting the ball. Humphries and Davis were two of the better chain movers a year ago, and they can hardly get their hands on the ball when our main issue is moving the chains. And getting other guys involved would benefit the only thing that we are doing consistently, which is handing the ball to the RB. There just seems to be a lot of untapped potential for an offense which is so effective when it needs to score (red zone and end of game scenarios) yet drags its ass most of the rest of the time I remember quite a few QB hits last year personally. But regardless, we also had two different guards last year. Spain was more of a pass protector than run blocker and Kline was a better pass protector than Davis is. Whereas both Saffold and Davis are run blockers first who struggle at times in pass protection, esp. in unfavorable situations. There also seems to be a lot of protection breakdowns, which to me is either coaching or a lack of cohesion due to the new group. DecepticonShawn, and Mythos27 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BudsOilers Posted November 14, 2019 Report Share Posted November 14, 2019 I can buy that OL cohesion is a factor but in terms of penalties, that's on the player to execute properly. Now, we can argue that without accountability - i.e. ramifications - it will continue. If they can simply eliminate the totally stupid penalties - false starts, unnecessary holding, or Lewan's idiotic personal foul stuff - it's a lot better. Mythos27, and tgo 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TerryBoats Posted November 14, 2019 Report Share Posted November 14, 2019 (edited) 12 minutes ago, BudAdams said: I can buy that OL cohesion is a factor but in terms of penalties, that's on the player to execute properly. Now, we can argue that without accountability - i.e. ramifications - it will continue. If they can simply eliminate the totally stupid penalties - false starts, unnecessary holding, or Lewan's idiotic personal foul stuff - it's a lot better. They were executing as well as any offense the last two years under two difference OCs, now they are among the worst. When a group goes from disciplined to undisciplined, from being among the best in the league scoring on the first drive to being terrible at it, from being above average at 3rd down conversion to terrible, a RB going from the fewest negative runs to the most, WRs going from being productive to unproductive, I think we have to look at the new guy who is responsible for getting these guys prepared and drawing up the plays Edited November 14, 2019 by abc2330 DCTitan 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
tgo Posted November 14, 2019 Report Share Posted November 14, 2019 3 minutes ago, abc2330 said: They were executing as well as any offense the last two years under two difference OCs, now they are among the worst. When a group goes from disciplined to undisciplined, from being among the best in the league scoring on the first drive to being terrible at it, from being above average at 3rd down conversion to terrible, a RB going from the fewest negative runs to the most, WRs going from being productive to unproductive, I think we have to look at the new guy who is responsible for getting these guys prepared and drawing up the plays Oh maybe I totally missed how awesome the offense was last year. Weird. And in terms of discipline, you're talking about a position group with almost half new players in terms of the OL. It's not the same group. We also have 2 of three new starting WRs. You can't just compare those two position groups to last year when half of the players at those positions weren't even here last year. Mythos27 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BudsOilers Posted November 14, 2019 Report Share Posted November 14, 2019 7 minutes ago, abc2330 said: They were executing as well as any offense the last two years under two difference OCs, now they are among the worst. When a group goes from disciplined to undisciplined, from being among the best in the league scoring on the first drive to being terrible at it, from being above average at 3rd down conversion to terrible, a RB going from the fewest negative runs to the most, WRs going from being productive to unproductive, I think we have to look at the new guy who is responsible for getting these guys prepared and drawing up the plays Their offense is ranked higher right now (with Tannehill) than in either 2017 or 2018 in Points Scored.... tgo, and Mythos27 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
StephenIsLegend Posted November 14, 2019 Report Share Posted November 14, 2019 I’d rather keep the continuity if Tannehill continues his play. reo 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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