Arthur Smith: Titans Will Ride Derrick Henry This Year

[Mythos27]

2 minutes ago, big2033 said:

 

No his numbers in the second half are ... a fact. He had one game with a better YPC than the entire second half. And he had games with less carries because coaches were unsure. They tried to trade him, he woke up.

 

Two, if you're going to go with your PFF or whatever third party, the fact that he may be getting more yards than what was blocked than Lewis doesn't matter when coupled with his other issues. I've always said that. Henry had to be play ABOVE and beyond the norms because where he was lacking in other areas.

 

If you're going to be a two-down back, you better be a monster on the first two downs and not need above average blocking to make it happen.

 

Three, Here's where I'll 100% admit I was wrong: I began to believe after watching Henry play that he wasn't capable of being better. I admired his work ethic so I thought he was putting full effort on the field and didn't have the feet. I was wrong. Henry proved to be complete capable physically of turning it around.

Look, I disagree that all the Eddie George/trade stuff did a damn thing. There is no way to substantiate that and you know it. Wen you start getting into how pople felt and their motivation, that's straight up speculation no matter how strongly you believe it or how forcefully you say it. Henry produced better in the second half because mostly because his OL started blocking well. We've been over this a million damn times and I definitely don't want to do the same song and dance again. It's old and boring. The PFF article showed in pretty clear detail that Henry was busting his ass early in the season. The two most relevant lines from that piece are the following:

 

"The issue, however, isn’t as much on Henry as it is on the Titans’ offensive line."

 

and 

 

"A better Henry came to play on Thursday, but the impressive, game-breaking display he put forth has indeed been in his wheelhouse all year; it’s just been masked by poor offensive line play."

 

I was saying those very same things before that article and you can call it what ever you want but I was right.You mock me for saying the coaches made the wrong call regarding Henry and Lewis while dismissing empirical data from PFF. 

[Mythos27]

22 minutes ago, big2033 said:

You willing to concede they also tried to trade Henry before he turned it around because of what THEY saw in his performance? 

 

Like you're not just arguing with me Mythos ... you're arguing with the entire organization.

I didn't concede anything. There was a report that we considered trading him and it never happened. You want to provide the proof that the report was true? Is every report automatically true?  Let's say I am arguing with the entire organization (I don't agree), aren't you doing the same when you go after Mariota? They seem to believe in him more than you do so why do you feel that as a lowly fan you're allowed or right to disagree?  In fact can any of us hold an opinion that runs counter to the company line or is that just ridiculous? You're essentially pulling an appeal to authority fallacy when we all (you included) question the organization regularly. 

Edited July 20, 2019 by Mythos27

[oldschool]

Henry wasnt running the same way at the beginning of the year as he was at the end of the year. The light came on and he exploded. Acting otherwise is foolish.

[big2033]

17 minutes ago, Mythos27 said:

I didn't concede anything. There was a report that we considered trading him and it never happened. You want to provide the proof that the report was true? Is every report automatically true?  Let's say I am arguing with the entire organization (I don't agree), aren't you doing the same when you go after Mariota? They seem to believe in him more than you do so why do you feel that as a lowly fan you're allowed or right to disagree?  In fact can any of us hold an opinion that runs counter to the company line or is that just ridiculous? You're essentially pulling an appeal to authority fallacy when we all (you included) question the organization regularly. 

Exactly. You're willing to believe nothing but what you believe. Even though it came out of his own and Eddie George's own mouth. They wanted to trade him. It's pretty obvious.

 

I'm the one making concessions here ... you're stuck in your own head. Did the interior have issues? Yes. 

 

Did Henry have the ability? Yes. I've conceded that.

 

You can't even concede they tried to trade him when an all-time Titan and the guy himself said the same.

 

And with Mariota, they do agree with me lol. They haven't signed him longterm have they? I'm not saying Mariota is a complete bust, I'm saying the issues with Mariota is mostly Mariota. Just like the issues with Henry were mostly Henry. 

 

It's up to Mariota to turn it around just like Henry did.

Edited July 20, 2019 by big2033

[OILERMAN]

7 minutes ago, oldschool said:

Henry wasnt running the same way at the beginning of the year as he was at the end of the year. The light came on and he exploded. Acting otherwise is foolish.

It’s just this simple 

[IsntLifeFunny]

4 hours ago, big2033 said:

Everyone was wrong about Derrick Henry. Including Derrick Henry. Only Mythos realized that Henry was playing well regardless.

 

Nine commented on it pretty often. 

[Mythos27]

1 minute ago, big2033 said:

Exactly. You're willing to believe nothing but what you believe. Even though it came out of his own and Eddie George's own mouth. They wanted to trade him. It's pretty obvious.

 

I'm the one making concessions here ... you're stuck in your own head. Did the interior have issues? Yes. 

 

Did Henry have the ability? Yes.

 

You can't even concede they tried to trade him when an all-time Titan and the guy himself said the same.

 

And with Mariota, they do agree with me lol. They haven't signed him longterm have they? 

You talk as though Eddie has any more access to J-Rob and his plans than we do. He doesn't he's just an ex-player and if J-Rob really was gonna trade Henry I'm sure Eddie wouldn't be privy to that. I'm not saying I'm unwilling to believe they wanted to trade him, I'm saying that just because Eddie believed the report it doesn't mean it's true, nor does it mean that it had a tangible effect on the field. We hear inaccurate reports all the time. Do you have a quote of Henry saying that they were trying to trade him? Because that I would definitely believe. Every time you rail against Mariota, you contradict what Vrabel and the coaching staff believe. They believe he still has a chance to be the guy, you think that ship has sailed. They clearly think he can play and have said so. You disagree. It doesn't stop there though. Every time you disagree with a draft pick or coaching decision you are disagreeing with people who are paid millions to know better than you. Does that mean you have to agree?  

[big2033]

3 minutes ago, IsntLifeFunny said:

Nine commented on it pretty often. 

Heh. If only Henry had the Titans forum to tell him to keep running and don't listen to coaches or other star RBs ... it's the line's fault.

[Mythos27]

13 minutes ago, oldschool said:

Henry wasnt running the same way at the beginning of the year as he was at the end of the year. The light came on and he exploded. Acting otherwise is foolish.

Was it true that he could only be successful running in the 4th quarter? Yes or no would do.

[Mythos27]

1 minute ago, big2033 said:

Heh. If only Henry had the Titans forum to tell him to keep running and don't listen to coaches or other star RBs ... it's the line's fault.

Just checking, was it true that he could only be successful running in the 4th quarter? Yes or no would do. We can resume the other conversation after your answer. 

[Mythos27]

8 minutes ago, OILERMAN said:

It’s just this simple 

Just checking, was it true that he could only be successful running in the 4th quarter? Yes or no would do. We can resume the other conversation after your answer. 

[big2033]

5 minutes ago, Mythos27 said:

You talk as though Eddie has any more access to J-Rob and his plans than we do. He doesn't he's just an ex-player and if J-Rob really was gonna trade Henry I'm sure Eddie wouldn't be privy to that. I'm not saying I'm unwilling to believe they wanted to trade him, I'm saying that just because Eddie believed the report it doesn't mean it's true, nor does it mean that it had a tangible effect on the field. We hear inaccurate reports all the time. Do you have a quote of Henry saying that they were trying to trade him? Because that I would definitely believe. Every time you rail against Mariota, you contradict what Vrabel and the coaching staff believe. They believe he still has a chance to be the guy, you think that ship has sailed. They clearly think he can play and have said so. You disagree. It doesn't stop there though. Every time you disagree with a draft pick or coaching decision you are disagreeing with people who are paid millions to know better than you. Does that mean you have to agree?  

LOL I'm not sure you know what I believe then. I believe he has a chance to be the guy. I just think it's unlikely. I also believe he deserves this year to prove it. I also believe Mariota is better than Tannehill for reasons including ceiling.

 

If the Coaches and JROB were 100% behind Mariota they'd sign him right now. The Eagles signed Wentz with a broken back. We're obviously unsure. So this idea that they're not in line with what I believe is ludicrous. They're giving him a year to prove he's above average. 

 

I think you see me arguing with homers and think I want to see Mariota in a trash heap. Not the case. I want Mariota to play better and his injuries and line and playcalling has nothing to do with his overall performance. Do these things matter? Yes. But no play calling etc. can keep a great QB at 13Tds ... I'm sorry.

 

Mariota playing like a star would be the best thing for our franchise. I'd honestly love it.

 

I'm just not making excuses for him and it frustrates people.

Edited July 20, 2019 by big2033

[OILERMAN]

1 minute ago, Mythos27 said:

Just checking, was it true that he could only be successful running in the 4th quarter? Yes or no would do. We can resume the other conversation after your answer. 

I’ve stated I think he could lead the league in rushing if his play carries over.

 

Im very pleased with his turnaround 

[Mythos27]

1 minute ago, big2033 said:

LOL I'm not sure you know what I believe then. I believe he has a chance to be the guy. I just think it's unlikely. I also believe he deserves this year to prove it. I also believe Mariota is better than Tannehill for reasons including ceiling.

 

If the Coaches and JROB were 100% behind Mariota they'd sign him right now. The Eagles signed Wentz with a broken back. They're unsure. So this idea that they're not in line with what I believe is ludicrous. They're giving him a year to prove he's above average. 

 

I think you see me arguing with homers and think I want to see Mariota in a trash heap. Not the case. I want Mariota to play better and his injuries and line and playcalling has nothing to do with his overall performance.

Ok fair enough. Were you a Locker fan? Did you agree with the coaches and FO when they took him and tried to make him a franchise QB for years? I didn't.

[big2033]

7 minutes ago, Mythos27 said:

Just checking, was it true that he could only be successful running in the 4th quarter? Yes or no would do. We can resume the other conversation after your answer. 

For a while that's where he found success yes. When defenses were tired he could run through them easier.

 

Henry was good in a 4 minute offense.

Edited July 20, 2019 by big2033