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Number9

Honor makes second Breakout Player list*Moving the Sticks*Now Prisco UPDATED

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japan   
5 hours ago, Justafan said:

Exactly.  This idea that somehow the OLB's are worse than last year makes me chuckle.  Wake was better than Morgan and Orakpo combined on a little over half as many snaps.  Finch was better and improving.  Landry was better and improving.  Correa was better and might not even make the roster.  They were all better.  Morgan and Orakpo set the edge but were horrible as pass rushers last year.  Bottoms in the league in terms of pressures and sacks.  

 

Wake was elite on a per snap basis.  Watch him and it's not even close.  Landry had 4.5 sacks in limited action and is primed to take a big step into year 2.  Finch could be really solid in his second year as well.  Walker has the potential to be a factor as well.  It's just laughable. 

Can't wait for this elite edge corp.  Who cares about depth when you have a 38 year old rusher (BTW, some arguing that he will set the world on fire, in the past have preached that age is a large deciding factor in the NFL [ie. the opinion that Walker was done after the 2017 season - before his injury] but they seem to be backsliding on that here.)  And I expect Landry to make a big jump this year but I also wouldn't say that he 'was better and improving' as he flashed relatively early and hit the wall while Evans was the one who came on late in the season and looked elite. 

 

I chuckle a little when I read the hype above for guys like Correa, or that Finch was some improving player as his stats show differently or people saying we are just going to plug that 5th round OLB in who we haven't even see practice with the team yet.  I hope you are right and that edge is a strength, but from the results of that weakness poll, I don't think I'm the only one concerned about it.

Edited by japan

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BudAdams   

The bottom line is that the team absolutely better get a consistent pass rush or the defense will definitely show a regression in terms of points allowed.  Last year, they faced 3 teams ranked in the top 10 in TD passes.  This year, they face 7.  They faced 8 games with teams in the 20's in terms of TD passes.  This year, they have 5 - including 2 versus the Jags and one versus Oakland where teams are expected to be better.

 

The offense will absolutely have to put up more points if they want to contend.

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Justafan   
5 hours ago, japan said:

Can't wait for this elite edge corp.  Who cares about depth when you have a 38 year old rusher (BTW, some arguing that he will set the world on fire, in the past have preached that age is a large deciding factor in the NFL [ie. the opinion that Walker was done after the 2017 season - before his injury] but they seem to be backsliding on that here.)  And I expect Landry to make a big jump this year but I also wouldn't say that he 'was better and improving' as he flashed relatively early and hit the wall while Evans was the one who came on late in the season and looked elite. 

 

I chuckle a little when I read the hype above for guys like Correa, or that Finch was some improving player as his stats show differently or people saying we are just going to plug that 5th round OLB in who we haven't even see practice with the team yet.  I hope you are right and that edge is a strength, but from the results of that weakness poll, I don't think I'm the only one concerned about it.

Wake started in the NFL late.  He's an exception to the age rule for multiple reasons.  Obviously, he's not the same guy he was five years ago but he doesn't have to be in order to be better than Orakpo or Morgan which was the point.  

 

Walker has a better than average chance to come back too because he wasn't used as much early in his career and has always taken care of himself.  

 

Landry might have hit a wall or teams might have recognized him as the bigger threat and started scheming to make him less effective.  We'll see what he does but generally, players take their biggest leap from year 1 to 2 so it's not crazy to expect him to take a step forward.  Unless you said something stupid and are now trying to double down I guess.  

 

No one hyped Correa or Finch.  Please show me the stats that Finch wasn't some improving player (as you put it) since he was an UDFA rookie who played in limited snaps on earlier downs and still managed to outproduce the two starters.  I would love to hear that argument.  No one said anything about plugging in Walker either, just that he should be expected to rotate in on run downs at least.  That's not exactly a big ask for a guy that many projected to go in the second round prior to his injury.  

 

By all means though, keep going.  You're really nailing it!

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Justafan   

Bottom line is that Titans were bottom half (around 16 or 17 if adjusted for percentage) for sacks, 18th in yards per run allowed, etc.  To make matters worse, the majority of the sacks came from the ILBs and the DBs and not the OLBs.  Casey, a 3T was the sack leader on the defensive line.  Your two starting OLBs last year combined for, what, 2-3 sacks?

 

It's not exactly a high bar this year's crop of edge players have to hurtle over to be better than last year.  Any damn idiot can see that.  

Edited by Justafan

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japan   
1 hour ago, Justafan said:

Bottom line is that Titans were bottom half (around 16 or 17 if adjusted for percentage) for sacks, 18th in yards per run allowed, etc.  To make matters worse, the majority of the sacks came from the ILBs and the DBs and not the OLBs.  Casey, a 3T was the sack leader on the defensive line.  Your two starting OLBs last year combined for, what, 2-3 sacks?

 

It's not exactly a high bar this year's crop of edge players have to hurtle over to be better than last year.  Any damn idiot can see that.  

You seem to be pretty passionate on this but everything you cite is just pure speculation. As edge was the runaway leader in the weakness poll, I think a lot of people are concerned about the lack of depth and the fact that we only really have 1.5 starters and a bunch of ‘improved’ UDFAs and a rookie 5th rounder. 

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Justafan   
22 minutes ago, japan said:

You seem to be pretty passionate on this but everything you cite is just pure speculation. As edge was the runaway leader in the weakness poll, I think a lot of people are concerned about the lack of depth and the fact that we only really have 1.5 starters and a bunch of ‘improved’ UDFAs and a rookie 5th rounder. 

It's all speculation.  You're speculating that Wake will fall off a cliff, none of the young guys can produce (even though they did last year) and Landry won't take the expected step.  

 

I'm not passionate about it.  Anything could happen.  Everything you predicted COULD happen.  I'm just pointing out the stupidity of it because they would all have to be incredibly bad to be worse than Orakpo and Morgan were last year and that's just not very likely.  Both Kenny Vacarro and Kevin Byard outproduced Orakpo and Morgan last year... as DBs.  The OLBs were historically bad and yet you're predicting these guys could be worse.  It's silly.  

Edited by Justafan

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japan   
2 minutes ago, Justafan said:

It's all speculation.  You're speculating that Wake will fall off a cliff, none of the young guys can produce (even though they did last year) and Landry won't take the expected step.  

 

I'm not passionate about it.  Anything could happen.  Everything you predicted COULD happen.  I'm just pointing out the stupidity of it because they would all have to be incredibly bad to be worse than Orakpo and Morgan were last year and that's just not very likely.  Both Kenny Vacarro and Kevin Byard outproduced Orakpo and Morgan last year... as DBs.  The OLBs were historically bad and yet you're predicting these guys could be worse.  It's silly.  

Ha ha.  You are the one passionately arguing with me about my opinion and the majority opinion on this board.

Edited by japan

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Justafan   
5 minutes ago, japan said:

Ha ha.  You are the one passionately arguing with me about my opinion and the majority opinion on this board.

What a joke.

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japan   
12 minutes ago, Justafan said:

I tell you what @japan, if Wake and Landry fail to produce more than two sacks on the year, you can come back and say I told you so. 

Yeah, I was about to say that both of us just have opinions and we should see how it plays out as we've been kind of going round and round on this.  Nothing would make me happier than for you to be right and these guys to produce.  Well, maybe if Mariota returned to his 2016 stretch play I would be happier...

 

BTW, I'm not arguing that Orakpo and Morgan should have been kept.  I'm just not impressed with the steps we took to fix that position.

Edited by japan

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Number9   

I think what may be getting overlooked or isn't being considered enough is what the coaching staff thinks about the edge.  We have a pretty good DC, HC and GM.  They are very familiar with these guys and think they'll be okay in these roles.  They think these younger players will make up in youth what Po and Morgan had in years of experience.

Edited by Number9

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nine   
1 hour ago, japan said:

BTW, I'm not arguing that Orakpo and Morgan should have been kept.  I'm just not impressed with the steps we took to fix that position.

 

Edge rushers have obviously been a mainstay of defensive football philosophy...well, pretty much forever.   JRob obviously recognizes this and addressed it by trading up for Landry last year.

 

However, I’ve heard at least one NFL analyst mention that recent trends have put the emphasis more on interior pass rushers...guys like Aaron Donald who wreak havoc up the middle and put pressure right in the quarterback’s face, where they can’t just step up in the pocket. The Simmons pick suggests this is likely JRob’s vision for the Titans D as well.  

 

There’s obviously no such thing as having too many quality  pass rushers..but at the end of the day, pressure is pressure, regardless whether it comes from the edge or the interior.  

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11 hours ago, japan said:

Can't wait for this elite edge corp.  Who cares about depth when you have a 38 year old rusher (BTW, some arguing that he will set the world on fire, in the past have preached that age is a large deciding factor in the NFL [ie. the opinion that Walker was done after the 2017 season - before his injury] but they seem to be backsliding on that here.)  And I expect Landry to make a big jump this year but I also wouldn't say that he 'was better and improving' as he flashed relatively early and hit the wall while Evans was the one who came on late in the season and looked elite. 

 

I chuckle a little when I read the hype above for guys like Correa, or that Finch was some improving player as his stats show differently or people saying we are just going to plug that 5th round OLB in who we haven't even see practice with the team yet.  I hope you are right and that edge is a strength, but from the results of that weakness poll, I don't think I'm the only one concerned about it.

I’m not going to delve too far in, but Finch is exactly the kind of guy you want taking over for Morgan in the base. 

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5 hours ago, Justafan said:

Bottom line is that Titans were bottom half (around 16 or 17 if adjusted for percentage) for sacks, 18th in yards per run allowed, etc.  To make matters worse, the majority of the sacks came from the ILBs and the DBs and not the OLBs.  Casey, a 3T was the sack leader on the defensive line.  Your two starting OLBs last year combined for, what, 2-3 sacks?

 

It's not exactly a high bar this year's crop of edge players have to hurtle over to be better than last year.  Any damn idiot can see that.  

What Morgan and Orakpo provided was a sound scheme that didn’t leak. Going off of memory we didn’t give up a single long TD on the ground last year besides the one in Houston. Both of them were beasts in the base.

 

I agree we will be better rushing the passer this year. We are definitely losing two elite edge setters though. Time to change the scheme up. 

Edited by IsntLifeFunny

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