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4 hours ago, NashvilleNinja said:

And you have JJ Abrams coming out recently talking about how The Last Jedi didn't ruin the plans of the trilogy.

No, what ruined the plans for the trilogy was the dismissal of George Lucas' treatments that he'd planned for episode 7 when he was considering making a new triology before Disney came along with their offer to buy up everything. Whatever a person's opinion of Lucas was/is, no one knows Star Wars like the man who created the story in the first place. Lucas should have been more involved/consulted about a new trilogy, but whatever. The spilled milk isn't going back up the strange sea creature's 8 titties.

I might have agreed on Lucas before seeing the prequels. But his stories were mostly not very good. Honestly the best of Star Wars was written by Larry Kasdan, not George Lucas.

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41 minutes ago, Starkiller said:

I might have agreed on Lucas before seeing the prequels. But his stories were mostly not very good. Honestly the best of Star Wars was written by Larry Kasdan, not George Lucas.

I think Lucas as a story guy (not screenwriter or director) could have been good. 

He’s just not good at directing or screenwriting. He is pretty good from a broad storyline perspective (most of the time). 

 

You need other people in there coming up with the story willing to tell him “no George, that’s a horrible idea.”

 

Then you need good people to implement the story in better ways to avoid terrible dialogue and wooden acting. 

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18 minutes ago, Titans279 said:

I think Lucas as a story guy (not screenwriter or director) could have been good. 

He’s just not good at directing or screenwriting. He is pretty good from a broad storyline perspective (most of the time). 

 

You need other people in there coming up with the story willing to tell him “no George, that’s a horrible idea.”

 

Then you need good people to implement the story in better ways to avoid terrible dialogue and wooden acting. 

I worked with a guy who interned on the prequels. He said Lucas was a raging asshole and refused to accept criticism or ideas from anyone on set. The worst example he gave was McGregor wanting to change some dialogue. Lucas went off on him and told him to stay in his lane.

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2 hours ago, Starkiller said:

I might have agreed on Lucas before seeing the prequels. But his stories were mostly not very good. Honestly the best of Star Wars was written by Larry Kasdan, not George Lucas.

Yes. Lucas' reputation was never lower than in those years after the prequels were done. He was seen as an old, out of touch clown of sorts. So no surprise that they didn't involve him. Still you'd think they would use something, anything from a broad perspective, just to be able to tie it in genetically with Lucas but again, I guess that is just how poorly he was thought of. 

 

The big mistake they made was not having an entire trilogy outline, instead allowing different directors to do their own, complete story. 

 

Abrams gets a lot of criticism for TFA due to it's similarity to A New Hope but it was probably exactly what was needed. The aesthetic look and feel of Star Wars returning was the most important thing, I think. 

 

Rey is cool but the character of Finn is just a waste. Might as well not even be there. 

 

Rian Johnson SJW'd the shit out of the next one, ruined Luke, and introduced a most annoying phrase: "subversion of expectations". There were some good parts to TLJ but overall there's something madly irritating about it. And the Canto Bite stuff looked very prequelish. 

Edited by 'Nator

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8 minutes ago, 'Nator said:

Yes. Lucas' reputation was never lower than in those years after the prequels were done. He was seen as an old, out of touch clown of sorts. So no surprise that they didn't involve him. Still you'd think they would use something, anything from a broad perspective, just to be able to tie it in genetically with Lucas but again, I guess that is just how poorly he was thought of. 

 

The big mistake they made was not having an entire trilogy outline, instead allowing different directors to do their own, complete story. 

 

Abrams gets a lot of criticism for TFA due to it's similarity to A New Hope but it was probably exactly what was needed. The aesthetic look and feel of Star Wars returning was the most important thing, I think. 

 

Rey is cool but the character of Finn is just a waste. Might as well not even be there. 

 

Rian Johnson SJW'd the shit out of the next one, ruined Luke, and introduced a most annoying phrase: "subversion of expectations". There were some good parts to TLJ but overall there's something madly irritating about it. And the Canto Bite stuff looked very prequelish. 

Rian Johnson didn’t ruin Luke, just the rest of the movie.

 

I found Luke’s fall to be very believable. In fact, most of the good parts of Last Jedi to me were the ones with Rey and/or Luke. The rest was mostly shit. 

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51 minutes ago, Starkiller said:

Rian Johnson didn’t ruin Luke, just the rest of the movie.

 

I found Luke’s fall to be very believable. In fact, most of the good parts of Last Jedi to me were the ones with Rey and/or Luke. The rest was mostly shit. 

Luke's fall was fine. Killing him off was not.

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2 minutes ago, oldschool said:

Luke's fall was fine. Killing him off was not.

You make it sound like he won’t be back in the finale...

 

He sacrificed himself to save Leia and the resistance. I think it worked fine. Arguably made more sense than Obi Wan sacrificing himself. 

Edited by Starkiller

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45 minutes ago, Starkiller said:

Rian Johnson didn’t ruin Luke, just the rest of the movie.

 

I found Luke’s fall to be very believable. In fact, most of the good parts of Last Jedi to me were the ones with Rey and/or Luke. The rest was mostly shit. 

Good god, SK. The idea that older, wiser Luke would just about kill his own nephew when years earlier a younger, not-as-wise Luke brought the most galaxy's most feared villian back from the dark side out of shear compassion, is complete bullshit. If Jedi's regress that badly then why are Obi-Wan and Yoda seen as such sages in the OT? Or is the idea that Kylo Ren evoked more fear in Luke than Darth Vader? Is that really what we're going for here? That Kylo Ren is scarier than Darth motherfucking Vader? Like I said... bullshit.

 

The reason the moments with the character were good is because of Mark Hamill, not Rian Johnson.

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9 minutes ago, NashvilleNinja said:

Good god, SK. The idea that older, wiser Luke would just about kill his own nephew when years earlier a younger, not-as-wise Luke brought the most galaxy's most feared villian back from the dark side out of shear compassion, is complete bullshit. If Jedi's regress that badly then why are Obi-Wan and Yoda seen as such sages in the OT? Or is the idea that Kylo Ren evoked more fear in Luke than Darth Vader? Is that really what we're going for here? That Kylo Ren is scarier than Darth motherfucking Vader? Like I said... bullshit.

 

The reason the moments with the character were good is because of Mark Hamill, not Rian Johnson.

Luke didn't try to kill Ben. He only considered it (not sure how much better that is). Ben just thought Luke was about to kill him. 

 

But that does mirror Luke trying to kill Vader before stopping himself at the last minute in ROTJ. 

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5 minutes ago, Starkiller said:

Luke didn't try to kill Ben. He only considered it (not sure how much better that is). Ben just thought Luke was about to kill him. 

 

But that does mirror Luke trying to kill Vader before stopping himself at the last minute in ROTJ

Those were far more dangerous and dire circumstances where he was surrounded by the universe's two most evil men plotting and carrying out the visible destruction of the rebel resistance. And even in that he backed away, as a younger Jedi less strong in the force.

 

No amount of darkness in Kylo would or should have made him fearful to the point that he's about to strike him down with a light saber while he was asleep. Search your feelings, SK. You know it to be true.

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