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"Marcus Mariota is the NFL's Best Passer in Obvious Passing Situations"

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BudAdams   
2 minutes ago, nine said:

The article specifies “obvious passing situations”.   The fact is, Marcus put up pretty spectacular numbers in these situations for 2018:

 

3rd & 7+:   126.7 passer rating

3rd & 10+:  :  113.1 passer rating

4th & 10+ :   118.8 passer rating

 

I’ve checked the numbers for several other QBs as well...Brady, Brees, Mahomes, Wilson, Ryan, Luck, Roethlisberger, Watson, and others.   I have yet to find one who rated as highly as Marcus in similar situations;   most of them aren’t even close.

 

Here’s what’s crazy:  as efficient as Marcus was in bad situations...in more favorable  down/distance situations, he was absolutely terrible. 

 

1st & <10:  56.3 rating 

2nd & 4-6:   62.2 rating

3rd & 4-6:  62.5 rating

Did the numbers also show 1st down conversion % for some context?

 

Do the same comparison for Red Zone passing stats.  IMO, that's where he's absolutely awful in comparison.  At the same time, it's an area he could make a big jump up even if he was average (Hint he's been 27th the last two years)

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Huston   
8 minutes ago, BudAdams said:

Let's see:

 

They first signed Matthews and Douglas, drafted Sharpe in round 4, and then drafted Davis # 5 overall and Taylor day 2.

They added Murray, Henry, and then Lewis at RB whereas they previously had Sankey and McCluster.

They signed Jones at Center and drafted Conklin

They drafted Smith and added Stocker at TE to go with Walker.  Later Firkster was signed and did well last year.

 

As for coaching, they fired Whiz so he wouldn't get killed in the pocket.  Mularkey DID help him as he had his best stretch of football ever production wise with him in that 8 game stretch.  They change last year to bring LaFluer in again was done to help Mariota. 

Robinson came in and started to add talent to the wr and Te position through the draft and was successful there but didnt get the guys he wanted in free agency and and we saw the inconsistent play you get from rookie wr's the last 2 years. Its not even worth mentioning your first list of players, the fact they are nearly replacing all 3 IOL spots shows you how below average the players on offense have been.

Edited by Huston

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39 minutes ago, BudAdams said:

Perhaps his definition of a generational talent is different.  To me, that's reserved for guys like Elway, Manning, and Luck, all of whom were the unquestioned #1 pick and day one franchise QB.  Go back and look at the scouting reports on Mariota in 2015.  Most thought he had the potential to be a very good QB but it would take some time.  His comps were guys like Kaepernick and Tannehill.

 

As for the team support, I call BS.  They did tons of things to support Mariota in personnel and some of the coaching changes were done specifically to help him.  I do think some of this different OC stuff is exaggerated.  They didn't change the playbook in 2015 when Michaels took over from Whisenhunt as the OC.  The Mularkey playbook is different than Whiz but the terminology - i.e. language - is the same and he was in that for two years.  LaFleur came in with a totally different scheme/terminology.  Smith apparently is keeping that intact.

 

Regarding Bortles, he went through 3 OC's in his first 3 seasons.  He's not a great QB by any means but he's accomplished as much as Mariota has with similar and perhaps less offensive talent around him. 

 

You guys are un-fucking believable in your narratives.

Name a single Titans' starting WR left over from the 2015-2016 seasons who is starting anywhere in the league.  We'll wait.

 

There aren't any because they sucked, or were washed up.  The closest to non-suckage receivers from those years are Matthews and Sharpe in 2017.

 

There are 3 offensive skill players left over from those years still considered starters at ANY position, and Marcus is one of them.

Delanie, Henry and Marcus.  As far as everyone else, if they had anything left in the tank, Mularkey destroyed it.

 

Then they added a couple in '17, and proceeded to change everything from the coaches to the playbook to the verbiage on them in '18, so they had to start over in their 2nd year.

 

Your idea of "support" and everyone else's, are two very different things.

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BudAdams   

There is as much inconsistent play from the QB as there is from the other offensive position groups. 

 

Some of Robinson's solutions were not long term (Murray, Matthews, the Guards) but at the same time he drafted a WR at 5 and spend decent money on Lewis to add to Henry. 

 

As for the OL, fact is that the scheme change was a factor too.

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Huston   
3 minutes ago, BudAdams said:

There is as much inconsistent play from the QB as there is from the other offensive position groups. 

 

Some of Robinson's solutions were not long term (Murray, Matthews, the Guards) but at the same time he drafted a WR at 5 and spend decent money on Lewis to add to Henry. 

 

As for the OL, fact is that the scheme change was a factor too.

Now I do agree with the scheme change affecting the Oline's level of play.

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BudAdams   
7 minutes ago, TitanDuckFan said:

You guys are un-fucking believable in your narratives.

Name a single Titans' starting WR left over from the 2015-2016 seasons who is starting anywhere in the league.  We'll wait.

 

There aren't any because they sucked, or were washed up.  The closest to non-suckage receivers from those years are Matthews and Sharpe in 2017.

 

There are 3 offensive skill players left over from those years still considered starters at ANY position, and Marcus is one of them.

Delanie, Henry and Marcus.  As far as everyone else, if they had anything left in the tank, Mularkey destroyed it.

 

Then they added a couple in '17, and proceeded to change everything from the coaches to the playbook to the verbiage on them in '18, so they had to start over in their 2nd year.

 

Your idea of "support" and everyone else's, are two very different things.

I could care less what the roster looked like in 2015.  It's completely irrelevant given the talentless group it was.  Besides that. the NFL roster turnover typically is around 20 - 25 % annually.  Players will come and go.  Robinson has consistently invested picks and FA dollars to help the offense since he's been the GM

 

 

 

 

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11 minutes ago, BudAdams said:

I could care less what the roster looked like in 2015.  It's completely irrelevant given the talentless group it was.  Besides that. the NFL roster turnover typically is around 20 - 25 % annually.  Players will come and go.  Robinson has consistently invested picks and FA dollars to help the offense since he's been the GM.

So what you're saying is they tried.  That doesn't mean they succeeded.

But considering who's left from those days, it would be hard for anyone to make a reasonable argument that they succeeded.  They obviously didn't.

 

We know how Mularkey came to be the coach and that was a joke.

JRob was a rookie GM who went after the types of players the joke-of-a-coach wanted, and now here we are, hoping there's enough consistency between yr1 and yr2 of the Vrabel regime to bring stability for the players Vrabel wanted, because his OC is gone and the choice of offensive skill players will be predicated on what another rookie coach wants.

Gee, what could go wrong?

 

LOL

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BudAdams   
10 minutes ago, TitanDuckFan said:

So what you're saying is they tried.  That doesn't mean they succeeded.

But considering who's left from those days, it would be hard for anyone to make a reasonable argument that they succeeded.  They obviously didn't.

 

We know how Mularkey came to be the coach and that was a joke.

JRob was a rookie GM who went after the types of players the joke-of-a-coach wanted, and now here we are, hoping there's enough consistency between yr1 and yr2 of the Vrabel regime to bring stability for the players Vrabel wanted, because his OC is gone and the choice of offensive skill players will be predicated on what another rookie coach wants.

Gee, what could go wrong?

 

LOL

I think they clearly succeeded.  A team that won 5 games in two years with the least talented roster in football has put together three straight 9 win seasons and has been in playoff contention every year under Robinson.  He has not been 100% in his personnel moves but in some cases, the solutions were known to be short term such as Murray for example or the veteran WR like Douglas, Johnson, or Decker at the ends of their careers. 

 

Mularkey did fine turning things around and it's unquestionable that Mariota's best stretch of play occurred under him.  You can argue that the regression of Mariota in 2017 cost Mularkey his job.  As for the OC switch now, to me it's a non-issue since the playbook and terminology are not changing and LaFluer was a first year play caller.  Smith has been around and seems as qualified as LaFluer was.  If I were you, I'd be more worried about Tannehill taking Mariota's job when he inevitably misses time.

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9 minutes ago, BudAdams said:

I think they clearly succeeded.  A team that won 5 games in two years with the least talented roster in football has put together three straight 9 win seasons and has been in playoff contention every year under Robinson.  He has not been 100% in his personnel moves but in some cases, the solutions were known to be short term such as Murray for example or the veteran WR like Douglas, Johnson, or Decker at the ends of their careers. 

 

Mularkey did fine turning things around and it's unquestionable that Mariota's best stretch of play occurred under him.  You can argue that the regression of Mariota in 2017 cost Mularkey his job.  As for the OC switch now, to me it's a non-issue since the playbook and terminology are not changing and LaFluer was a first year play caller.  Smith has been around and seems as qualified as LaFluer was.  If I were you, I'd be more worried about Tannehill taking Mariota's job when he inevitably misses time.

Why would I "worry" about Tannehill?  If he succeeds and Marcus fails, or is injured again I lose nothing.

And nothing about that changes what happened, that so few of you will or can admit.  The dumpster fire that was the Titans organization is on the way up.

But I believe there's still plenty of heat in that dumpster and it could re-ignite at any time.  It came close to that last year.

 

Don't tell us you were supremely confident in the Titans as a team after Delanie and Marcus went down, Lewan got concussed and Matthews quit.

Of all the things JRob and Vrabel have been able to do, holding the team together through that mess was tantamount to a miracle, and to come out of it 9-7 was worthy of much praise.  I happen to believe Mariota had quite a bit to do with that as well.

But it was also the first sign of a truly cohesive organization the Titans have displayed in the last 6-7 years.

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22 minutes ago, BudAdams said:

I think they clearly succeeded.  A team that won 5 games in two years with the least talented roster in football has put together three straight 9 win seasons and has been in playoff contention every year under Robinson.  He has not been 100% in his personnel moves but in some cases, the solutions were known to be short term such as Murray for example or the veteran WR like Douglas, Johnson, or Decker at the ends of their careers.

So, those last 3 years BTW,...  Which skill player was the common denominator on offense?

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13 minutes ago, FRT said:

Ahh this just in .... MM is tied for being the highest rated passer on Tuesday, Wednesday and Friday Nights in the NFL.  Should I start another thread?

Might as well.

If you don't, somebody else will.

And somebody else will start the thread about how he's the worst on Sunday, Monday, and Saturday afternoons anyway so,...

Whaddaya got to lose?

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8MM   
49 minutes ago, BudAdams said:

I think they clearly succeeded.  A team that won 5 games in two years with the least talented roster in football has put together three straight 9 win seasons and has been in playoff contention every year under Robinson.  He has not been 100% in his personnel moves but in some cases, the solutions were known to be short term such as Murray for example or the veteran WR like Douglas, Johnson, or Decker at the ends of their careers. 

 

 

 

31 minutes ago, TitanDuckFan said:

So, those last 3 years BTW,...  Which skill player was the common denominator on offense?

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2 hours ago, BudAdams said:

Let's see:

 

They first signed Matthews and Douglas, drafted Sharpe in round 4, and then drafted Davis # 5 overall and Taylor day 2.

They added Murray, Henry, and then Lewis at RB whereas they previously had Sankey and McCluster.

They signed Jones at Center and drafted Conklin

They drafted Smith and added Stocker at TE to go with Walker.  Later Firkster was signed and did well last year.

 

As for coaching, they fired Whiz so he wouldn't get killed in the pocket.  Mularkey DID help him as he had his best stretch of football ever production wise with him in that 8 game stretch.  They change last year to bring LaFluer in again was done to help Mariota. 

you must be confused. 

 

harry douglas, a 6th round WR pick, stocker, and  fisker do not count as anything more than below average players. fuck man we had nick williams and cameron batson starting last season... with 2 undrafted FA TE's

 

 

murray was good for 6 games before he was completely washed up.

matthews quit.

the coaches just figured out how to use henry in the final 6 games of his 3rd season.. effectively wasting 2.5 seasons of him.

lewis showed hes purely a 3rd down back

jones sucks and is old and doesnt fit the blocking scheme,

conklin might not fit the blocking scheme and should have / did sit the year healing

walker was here before  - and missed the whole season. 

 

then you admit theres been a carousel of coaches. 

 

so basically the titans brought in 2 WR (davis/TT) and a TE (smith)who have been painstakingly slow to develop - most of which the blame is placed directly on the players by coaches/scouts/writers/stats websites... and a RB in henry who didnt know how to run using his size and wasnt utilized by coaches properly until the end of year 3. An OC who left, and a WR in matthews who quit. 

 

The effort has been status quo. The current talent and game experience for skill players is below average. 

 

.. and as others have stated.. .theres a huge difference between trying and succeeding. 

 

 

Edited by titanruss

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