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6 minutes ago, JakePA_Titan said:

Did you not hear what she said or are you trying to be techincal?

 

If it's the latter you should be aware that to me, anyone who offers their opinion on a movie is a critic, even if they are not paid to do so.

That is a fair point. However, my understanding of Larson’s point is that the professional reviews of those outside of the intended audience far outnumber those of the intended audience and affects the box office and chances of more movies of a similar style. 

 

But that leads to an argument of a market existing to make more movies worthwhile. Either way, it sounds like a few people got their feelings hurt and have too much time in their hands. 

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2 hours ago, CreepingDeath said:

Incel = involuntarily celibate. Online community that whines together into hatred of women, “chads”, and society and blames them for their situation and lack of sex and overall success. 

 

Read recently that they targeted CM and hyped the anime movie Alita. 

I know there are women-hating groups of anonymous keyboard warriors out there ready to strike anything female down, like there are groups for anything, but this isn't that. I could care less whether the lead in a film is male or female as long as they do a good job with it. There have been plenty of great female leads in action movies over the years. Sigourney Weaver, Linda Hamilton, Gal Gadot, Charlize Theron, Uma Thurman, Kate Beckinsale, etc. I don't remember any of them going off on feminist tangents to promote their films the way Larson did. I got the vibe from her like she thought she was the first true female lead to ever grace the screen. I doubt she actually thinks that, but that's the vibe I got.

 

And yeah, the movie Alita Battle Angel has gotten a lot of buzz from sci-fi geeks but I don't understand how that's a problem. If people liked the movie they liked the movie. It hasn't gotten as much love from the so-called "expert critics" as it has from the audience, but critics sometimes don't know their own asshole from a hole in the ground. And/or they're paid shills for the studios who pump one movie over another simply because that was the source of their greatest perks.

 

8 minutes ago, oldschool said:

It means you fell victim to fake news. Larson isnt out there claiming 40 year old white dudes shouldn't see her movie. The narrative was invented by 40 year old white dudes who dont like non white Male leads. 

Idk about that... the first I heard about all the white man-hating feminist propaganda was from 30 something black dudes on YouTube. 😕

I mean, she was the one who brought that stuff up during the press tour for the movie. And brought it up and brought it up and brought it up. And I'm looking at reviews of the movie itself and the feminist stuff is apparently baked right in. From the symbolic blasting of the True Lies Schwarzenegger cut out (biggest action film star of the time) but the leaving of Jamie Lee Curtis cutout alone, the emasculating of Nick Fury's character in the movie compared to all the other Marvel movies his character has been in, the bitch ass way Fury lost his eye, the turning of Mar-Vell into a woman when the character was male in the comics, the woman-dominated soundtrack of the movie, etc.

Is all that fake?

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2 minutes ago, NashvilleNinja said:

I know there are women-hating groups of anonymous keyboard warriors out there ready to strike anything female down, like there are groups for anything, but this isn't that. I could care less whether the lead in a film is male or female as long as they do a good job with it. There have been plenty of great female leads in action movies over the years. Sigourney Weaver, Linda Hamilton, Gal Gadot, Charlize Theron, Uma Thurman, Kate Beckinsale, etc. I don't remember any of them going off on feminist tangents to promote their films the way Larson did. I got the vibe from her like she thought she was the first true female lead to ever grace the screen. I doubt she actually thinks that, but that's the vibe I got.

 

And yeah, the movie Alita Battle Angel has gotten a lot of buzz from sci-fi geeks but I don't understand how that's a problem. If people liked the movie they liked the movie. It hasn't gotten as much love from the so-called "expert critics" as it has from the audience, but critics sometimes don't know their own asshole from a hole in the ground. And/or they're paid shills for the studios who pump one movie over another simply because that was the source of their greatest perks.

 

Idk about that... the first I heard about all the white man-hating feminist propaganda was from 30 something black dudes on YouTube. 😕

I mean, she was the one who brought that stuff up during the press tour for the movie. And brought it up and brought it up and brought it up. And I'm looking at reviews of the movie itself and the feminist stuff is apparently baked right in. From the symbolic blasting of the True Lies Schwarzenegger cut out (biggest action film star of the time) but the leaving of Jamie Lee Curtis cutout alone, the emasculating of Nick Fury's character in the movie compared to all the other Marvel movies his character has been in, the bitch ass way Fury lost his eye, the turning of Mar-Vell into a woman when the character was male in the comics, the woman-dominated soundtrack of the movie, etc.

Is all that fake?

Got the vibe?  From where?  Do you think you were unaware of the incel news you’ve been reading?

 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.ccn.com/captain-marvel-faces-boycott-backlash-over-brie-larsons-man-hating/amp

 

Some angry 40+ white guy snowflake is making bank ruling up the incels. 

 

What did you not like about Fury in the movie?

Did you know in the comics, they made Thor a woman?  They also made Spider-Man a *gasp* minority!  I hope you aren’t into musicals, because Hamilton might send you over the edge. 

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11 minutes ago, CreepingDeath said:

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.indiewire.com/2018/06/brie-larsons-i-do-not-hate-white-dudes-lack-of-inclusion-film-critics-1201974617/amp/

 

There is an endless supply of entertainment options out there. Why people pay attention to those that they aren’t interested in is beyond me. 

Well, there are a lot of fans who've spent a lot of time and money watching these Marvel films over the last ten years because it's all part of a big story that they were interested/invested in. A sizable number of them are pissed at what they see as a hijacking of the story for personal agendas.

 

It is what it is. I want to see CM, but I got ruined on The Last Jedi with the bad storytelling and low key politics that were injected into the film's DNA. Captain Marvel is just sounding like The Last Jedi for the MCU. And I've enjoy Star Wars a lot more than any of the Marvel films. So why should I spend money on that?

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1 minute ago, NashvilleNinja said:

Well, there are a lot of fans who've spent a lot of time and money watching these Marvel films over the last ten years because it's all part of a big story that they were interested/invested in. A sizable number of them are pissed at what they see as a hijacking of the story for personal agendas.

 

It is what it is. I want to see CM, but I got ruined on The Last Jedi with the bad storytelling and low key politics that were injected into the film's DNA. Captain Marvel is just sounding like The Last Jedi for the MCU. And I've enjoy Star Wars a lot more than any of the Marvel films. So why should I spend money on that?

You don’t have to. I’m sure Avengers Endgame will make sense to you w/o watching CM. 

 

When end I watched CM, I only caught a few small direct references to “woman-power” (didn’t notice the Arnold blasting - and who gives a shit, I wasn’t looking to be offended). A biker being a dick asking her to smile for him and some flashbacks to men in her life telling her she can’t do things was all I noticed. 

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57 minutes ago, CreepingDeath said:

That is a fair point. However, my understanding of Larson’s point is that the professional reviews of those outside of the intended audience far outnumber those of the intended audience and affects the box office and chances of more movies of a similar style. 

So I'm confused here. I didnt hear her specify professionals. 

 

I'm going to break that top one into pieces...

 

57 minutes ago, CreepingDeath said:

That is a fair point. However, my understanding of Larson’s point is that the professional reviews of those outside of the intended audience far outnumber those of the intended audience. 

So the ppl it was intended for didn't care much one way or the other to leave their opinion?

 

Maybe that is why she is upset and feels the need to attack those who did leave an opinion?

 

57 minutes ago, CreepingDeath said:

 

and affects the box office and chances of more movies of a similar style.

I haven't seen Wonder Woman or CM. Never been a fan of comics or the movies although I have watched some. But I would say both being comic based and both female leads, similar style. I'm sure you'd agree.

 

WW was the 7th highest grossing comic adaptation film. And if you take out the Avengers movies (which we should because I dont think it's fair to compare a movie with multiple heros/villains to a movie that is about an individual character even if they tie it in to the whole shebang), it was top 4. Black Panther was #1.

 

Shapiro made a good point. I'll post the video.

 

He says "When Black Panther does great, it's not indicative of how racist the country isnt, but when CM bombs, it is indicative of how sexist the country is". WW doing 7th highest gross should slap anyone in the face that believes the criticism is due to sexism/female lead.

 

 

Here's where I agree with Oldschool. I didnt see her saying it did bad because of sexism. But I have seen others reference that as a reason. And Shapiro does say (his opinion) she is laying ground work for the media to run with that narrative. And I dont think hes wrong about the media playing that angle. But I also dont believe that was Bries intention.

 

57 minutes ago, CreepingDeath said:

But that leads to an argument of a market existing to make more movies worthwhile. Either way, it sounds like a few people got their feelings hurt and have too much time in their hands. 

Theres no doubt ppl are making what she said a bigger deal than how I believe she meant it. But how she worded it and the manner in which she said, opened that opportunity. Same with Trump. Imo there are things he said that were taking differently than how he meant them. But does that stop ppl from saying he was in the wrong?

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1 hour ago, NashvilleNinja said:

I know there are women-hating groups of anonymous keyboard warriors out there ready to strike anything female down, like there are groups for anything, but this isn't that. I could care less whether the lead in a film is male or female as long as they do a good job with it. There have been plenty of great female leads in action movies over the years. Sigourney Weaver, Linda Hamilton, Gal Gadot, Charlize Theron, Uma Thurman, Kate Beckinsale, etc. I don't remember any of them going off on feminist tangents to promote their films the way Larson did. I got the vibe from her like she thought she was the first true female lead to ever grace the screen. I doubt she actually thinks that, but that's the vibe I got.

 

And yeah, the movie Alita Battle Angel has gotten a lot of buzz from sci-fi geeks but I don't understand how that's a problem. If people liked the movie they liked the movie. It hasn't gotten as much love from the so-called "expert critics" as it has from the audience, but critics sometimes don't know their own asshole from a hole in the ground. And/or they're paid shills for the studios who pump one movie over another simply because that was the source of their greatest perks.

 

Idk about that... the first I heard about all the white man-hating feminist propaganda was from 30 something black dudes on YouTube. 😕

I mean, she was the one who brought that stuff up during the press tour for the movie. And brought it up and brought it up and brought it up. And I'm looking at reviews of the movie itself and the feminist stuff is apparently baked right in. From the symbolic blasting of the True Lies Schwarzenegger cut out (biggest action film star of the time) but the leaving of Jamie Lee Curtis cutout alone, the emasculating of Nick Fury's character in the movie compared to all the other Marvel movies his character has been in, the bitch ass way Fury lost his eye, the turning of Mar-Vell into a woman when the character was male in the comics, the woman-dominated soundtrack of the movie, etc.

Is all that fake?

Lol you haven't seen it? I didnt take you for a snowflake. I just saw it and its laughable a bunch of dudes, you included, are in arms about some messaging in the movie. I have a 7 year old daughter and watching her eyes light up watching a female superhero lead was worth it to me. I'm secure enough in my masculinity to not be threatened by the movie. Can you say the same?

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14 minutes ago, oldschool said:

Lol you haven't seen it? I didnt take you for a snowflake. I just saw it and its laughable a bunch of dudes, you included, are in arms about some messaging in the movie. I have a 7 year old daughter and watching her eyes light up watching a female superhero lead was worth it to me. I'm secure enough in my masculinity to not be threatened by the movie. Can you say the same?

So in order to be ok with my masculinity I have to go see it? Like, if I don't go see it now I'm not man enough? Gtfo here with that weak ass reverse psychology. lol

Btw... did you show your daughter Wonder Woman yet? That had a female superhero lead too.

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1 hour ago, NashvilleNinja said:

So in order to be ok with my masculinity I have to go see it? Like, if I don't go see it now I'm not man enough? Gtfo here with that weak ass reverse psychology. lol

Btw... did you show your daughter Wonder Woman yet? That had a female superhero lead too.

You seem susceptible to fake news so if the show fits.

 

Yes she liked wonder woman but she prefers Marvel over DC.

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It seems like she's saying what almost any artist says if their stuff gets panned by critics, that it wasn't made for them and they only care about what their target fans think. So because she specifically mentioned 40 year old white men these guys gotta create bots to rate her movie a 1 star. I guess she could have been more PC about how she made her point. 😂

 

BTW the facts are that most film critics are white men and that they rate movies differently than women.

 

Sorry, facts don't care about your feelings!

 

Quote

The report found that 65% of the reviews by the “top critics” at 10 “notable daily newspapers” were written by white males; that 19.5% were written by white females; that 13.2% were written by minority males, and that only 2.3% were penned by minority females. 

 

...

 

At the entertainment trades...67.5% of the reviews surveyed were written by white males; 20.5% by white females; 9.6% by minority males, and 2.2% by minority females.

 

...

 

The report, which sampled the work of 2,413 critics, found that 67.1% of those individuals were men, and that 32.9% were women – a 3-1 male-to-female ratio.

 

And apparently identity does change how one scores a film. This seems obvious when talking about a teenage girl vs a 40 year old man, but it's even true with adult film critics.

 

Quote

Arguing that the race and gender of reviewers matters, the report found that white male reviewers rated films with female leads “lower than any other group.” On a scale of 1-10, the average white male reviewer gave films with female leads a score of 5.9, while the average minority female reviewer gave those same films a score of 6.9. Minority female reviewers, however, also gave slightly higher marks to films with white male leads than their white male counterparts – 6.2 compared to 6.1.

 

I would guess the 6.1 compared to 6.2 is not statistically significant, whereas the 5.9 to 6.9 is.

 

https://deadline.com/2018/09/usc-report-film-critics-white-men-studios-diversity-1202459018/

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Don't worry Ninja I get what youre saying. I wanted to watch Black Panther and CM but after the Last Jedi I have steered clear of any films injected with political bullshit. It ruins it. Im sure Black Panther and CM are pretty good movies though. I doubt they are as awful as TLJ, everything has just become political. Even football is becoming unbearable because of Politics. 

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looking forward to seeing it. just to see how it relates to the rest. 

 

hate political bullshit

 

these marvel movies are starting to gross huge numbers and will only get bigger because china has accepted them. 

 

the movie competition for captain marvel this weekend was laughable at best. 

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1 hour ago, Titans279 said:

It seems like she's saying what almost any artist says if their stuff gets panned by critics, that it wasn't made for them and they only care about what their target fans think. So because she specifically mentioned 40 year old white men these guys gotta create bots to rate her movie a 1 star. I guess she could have been more PC about how she made her point. 😂

You have to sign in with an account to rate movies on their site. Trolls maybe. Bots? Pretty sure no.

 

Btw... who do you think the target fans are of movies like Captain Marvel and Avengers? Maybe not quite 40 year olds, but there's a healthy dose of male in that target audience. I mean, they're by far the biggest group of consumers of that stuff.

 

1 hour ago, Titans279 said:

 

I would guess the 6.1 compared to 6.2 is not statistically significant, whereas the 5.9 to 6.9 is.

 

https://deadline.com/2018/09/usc-report-film-critics-white-men-studios-diversity-1202459018/

I could say that I've conducted a study that notes that all or most critics of white men tend to be women, but I doubt you'd believe the study. 

 

Anyway, I'll see it eventually just because I'm already invested in the MCU story arc and want to see how it plays out. But... fuck all this noise surrounding it. I'm tired of politics seeping into every aspect of every fucking thing. You think it's a coincidence I don't spend much time in the political sub? Are we not going to be allowed to take a bite of a ham sandwich soon without having to talk about the politics of how it got to our mouths?

 

18 minutes ago, GOAT9 said:

Don't worry Ninja I get what youre saying. I wanted to watch Black Panther and CM but after the Last Jedi I have steered clear of any films injected with political bullshit. It ruins it. Im sure Black Panther and CM are pretty good movies though. I doubt they are as awful as TLJ, everything has just become political. Even football is becoming unbearable because of Politics. 

I saw Black Panther after it hit OnDemand. I just didn't make it to the theater to see it but it was a really good movie from what I remember of it. Maybe it's because I wasn't looking for it or didn't know I was supposed to, but I didn't notice much identity politics in it. I mean, I noticed all the black people in the movie but I don't see how you can have a movie that's mostly about African people in an African continent ... without having African people in it.

 

The SJW/political low key stuff was an annoyance in The Last Jedi, but it was far from the most irritating thing about it. What wrecks that movie for me is what Rian Johnson did with Luke Skywalker's character. A 30 years younger Jedi, less wise in the force, was able to save the most heinous, Jedi-killing, universe oppressing villian in that universe from the dark side after he'd already been turned for over 20 years... but a 30 years older, wiser and stronger Jedi, was about to chop his own nephew in half because of a moment of doubt while he was asleep? A guy who hadn't actually turned to the dark side yet? At least in Return Of The Jedi you could understand why Luke snapped and went after Vader. He was being manipulated by Darth Sidious at the moment the rebel fleet and resistance was being ambushed and skull fucked by the empire. But even in that moment, right before Luke was going to kill Vader, he stopped.

Nevermind all the other bullshit in the movie, like the Space Adventures of Leia Poppins, the handling of Snoke, Rose coming out of nowhere to save Finn for a ridiculous romantic moment, the non-sense of the Rebel ship being just far enough out of range that the big bad First Order ship can do nothing about it except wait for it to run out of gas, the constant bitching from nega-Luke about how the Jedi order has to end only to see him whine like a bitch when Yoda appears out of nowhere to burn the ancient Jedi texts for him, etc etc.

 

Yeah, Rian Johnson can miss the fuck out of me with all that.

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