BudsOilers Posted January 9, 2019 Report Share Posted January 9, 2019 Very true. Belichick pre-Brady. Jimmy Johnson w/o Aikman. Walsh/Seifert w/o Montana or Young, Noll w/o Bradshaw, Dungy w/o Manning. Carroll w/o Wilson, etc. Applies to coaches w/o championships. Jeff Fisher was a way better HC with McNair than he was with anyone else. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Justafan Posted January 9, 2019 Popular Post Report Share Posted January 9, 2019 Walsh created a scheme that boosted two QBs to top 5 positions all time in the history of the NFL. His scheme was so successful that they still use concepts from it in the modern NFL. Belichick created a scheme good enough that Matt Cassell went 11-5 He's got a point but it's retarded to believe that scheme doesn't matter. Mythos27, TNTitans, Pragidealist, and 5 others 8 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BudsOilers Posted January 9, 2019 Author Report Share Posted January 9, 2019 He's not saying scheme doesn't matter but it's not the only thing either. Leading a team takes skills beyond drawing up plays. Walsh was a losing coach with his scheme until Montana arrived. Belichick was fired from Cleveland when he had Kosar and Testaverde as his QB. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BudsOilers Posted January 9, 2019 Author Report Share Posted January 9, 2019 LaFluer may be a perfect test case. Schematically, he seems like a smart guy but can he lead a team? McVay seems to have all the attributes you want (more so than Kyle Shanahan IMO) and saying that he's the mold everyone wants and he's yet to win a playoff game as a HC. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
NashvilleNinja Posted January 9, 2019 Report Share Posted January 9, 2019 1 hour ago, BudAdams said: LaFluer may be a perfect test case. Schematically, he seems like a smart guy but can he lead a team? McVay seems to have all the attributes you want (more so than Kyle Shanahan IMO) and saying that he's the mold everyone wants and he's yet to win a playoff game as a HC. I don't think that LaFleur is ready for a HC gig, but what do I know? I just think one of the reasons some of these first tiem HCs flame out is because they just weren't seasoned and ready enough for the job. It doesn't mean their approach is wrong, but I think he could have used another year or two of "seasoning". That said, he'll have Aaron Rodgers running his offense. Everyone talks about Belichick's midas touch, but Brady is a big fire-retardant blanket. There's nothing wrong with Lafleur's offense. As long as he can keep mistakes to a minimum Rodgers will take them far. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
titanruss Posted January 9, 2019 Report Share Posted January 9, 2019 2 hours ago, BudAdams said: Very true. Belichick pre-Brady. Jimmy Johnson w/o Aikman. Walsh/Seifert w/o Montana or Young, Noll w/o Bradshaw, Dungy w/o Manning. Carroll w/o Wilson, etc. Applies to coaches w/o championships. Jeff Fisher was a way better HC with McNair than he was with anyone else. What’s fishers excuse with foles? oh yeah... system matters. These guys keep these qbs because they run their system well. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
OILERMAN Posted January 9, 2019 Report Share Posted January 9, 2019 List the 10-20 greatest HCs in #NFL history and identify what made them successful. It'll frequently be because of their QBs (!) I've been saying that for years Thrill 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
OILERMAN Posted January 9, 2019 Report Share Posted January 9, 2019 7 hours ago, Justafan said: Walsh created a scheme that boosted two QBs to top 5 positions all time in the history of the NFL. Two great QBs boosted his scheme more Siefert(who took over) flopped without Young Thrill 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justafan Posted January 9, 2019 Report Share Posted January 9, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, OILERMAN said: Two great QBs boosted his scheme more Siefert(who took over) flopped without Young Um. Jeff Garcia, a journeyman QB, looked like a pro-bowler in that scheme. They weren't dominant like they were with Young but they still had a pretty good team and went to the playoffs a couple of times. Yea, it helps to have a HOF QB. Duh. I just looked it up. Seifert went 98-30 in his time there. .766 winning record over an 11-year stretch. That's flopping? Bring that flopping here to Nashville, please. Edited January 9, 2019 by Justafan Btowner, and TitanDuckFan 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
charleytolar Posted January 9, 2019 Report Share Posted January 9, 2019 34 minutes ago, Justafan said: Um. Jeff Garcia, a journeyman QB, looked like a pro-bowler in that scheme. They weren't dominant like they were with Young but they still had a pretty good team and went to the playoffs a couple of times. Yea, it helps to have a HOF QB. Duh. I just looked it up. Seifert went 98-30 in his time there. .766 winning record over an 11-year stretch. That's flopping? Bring that flopping here to Nashville, please. Three years (1999-2001) at the helm in Carolina: W 16 - L 32 including a final 1 - 15 season... so he was much better if you just consider the 8 Frisco years. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
OILERMAN Posted January 9, 2019 Report Share Posted January 9, 2019 48 minutes ago, Justafan said: I just looked it up. Seifert went 98-30 in his time there. .766 winning record over an 11-year stretch. That's flopping? Bring that flopping here to Nashville, please. No, flopping is when he went to the Panthers for 3 years and finished with two losing seasons, 1 8-8 season including a 1-15 final season. With Young/Monatana he had 8 consecutive double digit winning seasons including 3 14-2 seasons. Two SB wins as well. It doesn't take a lot of thought to figure out the difference in the two stints QB play Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
OILERMAN Posted January 9, 2019 Report Share Posted January 9, 2019 Walsh wins 3 SBs and multiple double digit seasons then Siefert basically does the same thing. Dallas wins SBs with Jimmy Johnson then a buffoon like Switzer also wins the SB. GB wins a SB with two different coaches with HOF QB play Belichich has a losing record over a massive sample size and got fired without Brady. Back to Sando's original point: A good exercise: List the 10-20 greatest HCs in #NFL history and identify what made them successful. It'll frequently be because of their QBs (!) CreepingDeath 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
OILERMAN Posted January 9, 2019 Report Share Posted January 9, 2019 2 minutes ago, Soxcat said: I'm going to go out on a limb here and state: 1. that coaches with the best players win more games and 2. since the most important player is the QB coaches with the best QBs win more games 3. coaches with HOF QBs typically win the most games Wow, now I'm a flipping expert. It's a start Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pat Posted January 9, 2019 Report Share Posted January 9, 2019 The best coaches develop the best QBs. After that it's QB. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
OILERMAN Posted January 9, 2019 Report Share Posted January 9, 2019 1 minute ago, patsplat said: The best coaches develop the best QBs. Maybe in some cases, hard to know how much credit the coach vs the QB gets, probably varies Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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